7 10 85 Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource UWA ORAL HISTORIES Description An account of the resource A collection of interviews with former UWA staff, recorded by the <a href="http://www.alumni.uwa.edu.au/community/historical-society" target="_blank">UWA Historical Society</a> to mark the Centenary of the University in 2013. <br />The UWA Historical Society’s <a href="http://www.alumni.uwa.edu.au/community/historical-society/oral-histories" target="_blank">Oral History Program</a> started as a project with four oral histories funded from Society resources. It was then expanded with support from every Faculty on campus, the Guild, Convocation and through private donations. Additional funding was received through a Heritage Grant. Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available University of Western Australia Historical Society Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource University of Western Australia Historical Society Oral History A resource containing historical information obtained in interviews with persons having firsthand knowledge. Interviewer The person(s) performing the interview Julia Wallis Interviewee The person(s) being interviewed Fred Chaney Duration Length of time involved (seconds, minutes, hours, days, class periods, etc.) Interview 1: 1 hour, 18 minutes, 5 seconds Interview 2: 1 hour 26 minutes, 27 seconds Total: 2 hours, 44 minutes, 32 seconds Bit Rate/Frequency Rate at which bits are transferred (i.e. 96 kbit/s would be FM quality audio) 128 kbs Time Summary A summary of an interview given for different time stamps throughout the interview Interview 1 Track 1 00:00 Introduction by Julia Wallis 00:35 Track 2 00:00 Frederick Michael Chaney born on 28 October 1941. Second child in a family of 7 children. Father, Sir Frederick Charles Chaney KBE AFC (20 October 1914-17 December 2001) fought in the Second World War. Grew up in South Perth and attended local schools. When they were living in North Perth, he attended Sacred Heart Convent aged 4 years old as he did not want to be separated from his older sister. This meant that he finished school relatively young. Father, Fred, brought up as a Baptist. Mother, Mavis, from large Australian Irish Catholic family. Parents met in primary school. Father became a teacher. They married and went to live near Corrigin. 04:44 When the Second World War broke out, his father joined the Australian Air Force and worked for some time as a flying instructor at Cunderdin. Later became a reconnaissance pilot for Z-Force. His father airlifted from Borneo the famous anthropologist, Tom Harrison. Fred Chaney Snr returned to teaching after the War. He became President of the RSL and helped returned soldiers to find housing. He was sporty and popular and was approached by the Liberal Party and was elected to the Australia House of Representatives for the Member for Perth in 1955. In1964, he was sworn in as Minister for the Navy in Robert Menzies’ Ministry (which was the last term of the Menzies government). He was dropped by Prime Minister Harold Holt by telegram. 11:45 Track 3 00:00 In 1969, there was a big swing against the Liberal Party and they lost Perth, Swan and Forrest. Fred Chaney Snr was appointed by John Gorton to be the administrator for the Northern Territory, a post he held from 1970 to 1973. During this time, he met Dame Margot Fonteyn . When Gough Whitlam became Prime Minister in 1972, he returned to Perth and was later made Lord Mayor (‘78-‘82). 02:28 Fred Chaney Snr did not try and influence the lives of his children even though Fred followed him into politics. His father inspired him to help other people. Fred got involved in politics at UWA at the age of 16 to try and change things. Fred had done well at school in his final years and won an Exhibition which meant that UWA allowed him to attend full-time. Fred enrolled in Economics but changed to Law when told by Terry O’Connor that the Law School was much more fun. 09:06 University broadened his horizons. He was active in the Liberal Club and the Blackstone Society. He was membership secretary of the Liberal Party and increased membership by enrolling attractive girls (including his future wife Angela). He was seeking a partner for the graduation ball and asked Angela to go as she hadn’t then been invited! He lived at home in Mt Lawley, while attending UWA. 11:18 The Law School was situated in very old buildings. There were only about 100 students. It was intimate and everyone knew each other very well. Professor Beasley encouraged the students to dress smartly in coats, ties and gowns. Some of the teachers were excellent; one was not. In his last year (1962), Fred set up the Education Committee of the Blackstone Society and reported into the standard of education at the Law School. In those days, you could approach the Dean and the Head of the Law School. The Law School was very social and heavily connected to the Guild Council. Traditionally Guild Presidents were from the Law School but the medical students did a big push to wrest it from them and in 1962, Richard Lugg became President. Fred opted to assist him as Vice President. Richard was the Chairman of the Legal & Constitutional Affairs Commission on the Guild and would have made an able lawyer! Fred was Acting President quite a lot when Richard was away. There were lots of university formal functions – faculty dinners and so on. His social activities meant that his academic results were not as good as they could have been. 16:04 Angela was studying for an Arts degree. There was rivalry between the other faculties – particularly with Engineering. The engineers threw Fred into the pond several times. He enjoyed Max Beerbohm’s novel about Oxford, Zuleika Dobson , and felt that he also enjoyed quite a frivolous time at UWA. Despite this, he was elected to be part of the University Moots Team in his final year. While debating in Melbourne he met Ron Castan , a member of the Melbourne team, and struck up a friendship with him. Ron became a human rights’ lawyer. They continued to meet through their mutual interest in the Aboriginal Legal Service. Ron Castan did 10 years work pro bono on the Mabo case (1982). 19:06 He feels enriched by the people he has met during his life. Mr Chaney presented the Toohey lecture at UWA on 4 September 2014 and talked about the critical role that lawyers played in getting Australia to recognise Aboriginal Native Title and led to various pieces of Aboriginal Land Rights Legislation. John Toohey , one of Fred Chaney’s first year lecturer’s, was appointed as the Land Commissioner. Fred believes that a university education should equip you to deal with all manner of people in the pursuit of good things. 22:31 People wanted to be Guild President to try and influence things. Fred was against the National Union of Australian Students adopting a political position. Learning how to listen, debate and argue is essential in learning to communicate with people who might not have the same views. The Western Australian Liberal Party has not been tolerant of Fred’s views on Aboriginal issues. You need to be able to reason with people and recognise different points of view. 24:37 Fred took Arts subjects as part of his undergraduate degree. He found History 2D (Chinese, Japanese and Indonesian History) one of the most influential subjects in his degree. He thought about giving law up. Fred did his Articles at Northmore Hale Davey & Leake. Eric Edwards managed to get him an appointment there. He found actually doing legal work for people to be very satisfying instead of studying law in isolation. He was very honest at recognising his limits in his knowledge of the law. 29:12 UWA Law students took an active interest in Aboriginal Land Rights. The Liberal Club worked with fringe dwellers in the Swan Valley. In 1961, they wrote a submission to the Parliamentary committee that was looking at Aboriginal voting rights. The penny dropped for Fred on Aboriginal issues with the publication of the Milirrpum judgment (known as the Gove land rights case) (1971). His father, who was living in Darwin at the time, sent him down the judgment. The Western Australian Mining industry was very anti-Aboriginal land rights. He believes that a good university graduate should be able to think independently. Part One of the Atlas of Australia’s War’s by ex UWA graduate, John Coates discusses the colonial era and the military operations against Aboriginal people. Fred has also had points of conflict where he has had to stand up for his own views. 34:36 There were only 3,000 students (including part-timers) when Fred was an undergraduate. There were a few Asian students. Most of the students were middle class. Fred had respect through his family connections. Religion was hotly debated within the student body. Fred was fiercely Catholic at the time and was a member of the Newman Society in first year. Protestants were in the ascendancy at the time. Fred was very involved with PROSH. 41:10 Fred remembers little of his graduation ceremony. He went straight into 2 year Articles at Northmore Hale. He enjoyed working with clients. He was admitted in about December 1963. His goal was to marry Angela and they married in April 1964. They wanted to do good works overseas in a Peace Corps type role and considered Africa. They were dismayed by the racist comments that were made by white ex residents who had migrated to Australia. The Director of Education in New Guinea was a friend of his father and organised for them to be able to stay with them consequently Fred became Crown Prosecutor in PNG from 1964-1965. 47:11 Before he left Fred for PNG, he was briefed at the School of Pacific Education in Sydney on the public service and cultural awareness. He did prosecuting work - there were lots of pay-back killings in PNG. He also did some constitutional work at the House of Assembly. He did not enjoy the political corruption and their colonial status and it was becoming violent. They had had their first child in PNG and decided to return to Australian to change things rather than try and do that in PNG. 54:34 Track 4 00:00 The practice of law in the 1960s and 70s was very different to now. Northmore Hale had a small number of partners and a wide range of clients. Fred Chaney was made a partner. There was a large local government element. There was a bit of commercial and litigation work. He did some criminal cases for Legal Aid. He moved to strike out one of the indictments and his address was heard by Ken Hatfield QC who asked him to come and work for him as his junior. It was mainly personal injury work and he spent a lot of time in court. Then he was called by Peter Wright of Hancock & Wright Prospecting and he offered Fred a job as their in-house lawyer (1966-1974). He mainly did taxation work. Their social attitudes did not marry with Fred’s. 04:20 He returned to Northmore Hale because they were in financial strife. People thought he was an expert in mining law. He developed a busy practice in the obtaining of mining tenements. There was a huge speculative boom going on during the mid-70s. Some were on Crown land and some on Stations. He had prevailed upon the State Government Minister for Mines in about 1968 to amend the Mining Act in order to give the farmers more protection. 07:40 Environment issues were not at the forefront in those days. There was great degradation done in the desert where parts were bulldozed through. The oil companies like Shell and Caltex started doing site avoidance in discussion with Aboriginal people in the late 1960s. 11:11 Interview 2 Track 1 00:00 Introduction by Julia Wallis 00:43 Track 2 00:00 In the 1960s there were opportunities to represent Aboriginal people. One case was an Aboriginal mother who was accused of neglecting her children. Fred won the case. The prosecution had stemmed from complaints that there were too many Aboriginals in East Perth. He kept doing work for Aboriginal people and there were other people who volunteered their time. It became a more organised legal service in the late 60s and became the Aboriginal Legal Service and Advice Bureau in 1972. This move was led by Robert French AM, current Chief Justice of the High Court of Australia. 04:30 Fred, Ian Temby QC and Peter Dowding SC agreed that there was a need for a shop front legal service and they recruited enough volunteer lawyers to operate a 5 day service in Forrest Place giving legal advice for $2. This was supported by the Law Society. Now most of the major Australian law firms have large pro bono practices. The relationship between lawyers and Aboriginal advancement has been very important. 07:13 The Aboriginal Legal Service mainly dealt with criminal cases. One example was a man who was locked up in Moora for 6 weeks on the charge of stealing by finding. Aboriginal incarceration is a big problem in Australia. The mining industry and the conservative Government in WA were both opposed to Aboriginal Land Rights. 11:18 Fred decided that he should enter politics. He felt he was effective in his political work and enjoyed policy and finding solutions to problems. He was continuously elected Senior Vice President of the Liberal Party from 1969-1973. He worked closely with Bob French within the Liberal Party and on the National Native Title Tribunal. At that time, the Liberal Party was a broad church. His views on Aboriginal matters were considered eccentric but his views were tolerated because he was a good operator and adhered to the party line on social and economic matters. From 1989 to 1990 he was the public face of the Federal Liberal Party in WA. 16:53 The State Liberal Party differs across Australia. Victoria was the most liberal when it came to Aboriginal affairs and Queensland and WA the most illiberal. Fred easily made the transition from State to Federal politics. He recalled that Sir Charles Court (Premier of Western Australia from 1974 to 1982) had disputes with the Commonwealth on several matters. Fred was quite politically astute as his family had been involved in politics for some time. As there were no seats in the House of Representatives, Fred ran for the Senate in an unwinnable seat. However, there was a Double Dissolution a few months later and he found himself in Parliament. 21:23 At that time, there was a generation of politicians in Canberra who were policy orientated on both sides of Parliament. They worked well together and formulated some good policy – e.g. no fault divorce. There was a reforming zeal in the Government. Fred believed the introduction of the Racial Discrimination Act (1975) to be very important and it was supported by both parties. The Woodward enquiry into land rights was another milestone. Bob Ellicott , former Chairman of the Gove Land case was also in Parliament and was Chairman of the Back Bench Committee on Aboriginal Affairs. There was across party support on Aboriginal Land Rights. Unfortunately, Western Australia was still unsupportive of land rights. It was believed to be a Communist plot. The Communist party had supported the walk-off from Wave Hill Station and the Gurindji strike. 26:28 Western Australia was behind even Queensland on Aboriginal land rights legislation. The Labor Party tried to force national land rights into WA. An ugly confrontation over exploration took place on Noonkanbah Station in 1980. From 1972-1983/4, there was a bipartisan approach on Aboriginal Land Rights. Western Mining and the Chamber of Mines led the opposition to Aboriginal Land Rights in WA. Aboriginal people now switched back to pursuing their rights through the courts from the mid-80s. Mabo (1989 and 1992) switched the balance of power and in 1993, the Native Title Act was passed. In 1995, Leon Davis, the CEO of CRA/Rio Tinto made some speeches proclaiming that the company would no longer fight against this. This led to a cultural and behavioral shift. 36:44 Fred was Whip at the time of the Whitlam dismissal and was Minister for Aboriginal Affairs from 1978-1980. He had a change of role every couple of years. Fred was very impressed with the calibre of the departmental staff. Fred was Minister of Social Security during a recession which was a very unpleasant experience. It was a period of intense debate about economic policy and it became quite bitter and personal. The Liberal Party came to the conclusion that economic reform was necessary and this enabled Bob Hawke to progress his agenda without much opposition. Fred believed that Prime Minister Bob Hawke was the right man for the right time. 48:08 In his one term in the House of Representatives, Fred was Shadow Minister for Environment and Sustainable Development from 1990 to 1993. Environment was quite fashionable then. Fred attended the Rio Convention in 1992 but there seemed to be little will to find answers. An excellent environmental report was “Our Common Future”, also known as the Brundtland Report, from the United Nations World Commission on Environment and Development that was published in 1987. Environmental issues and economic issues go hand in hand. 54:01 The Aboriginal problem is not just economic. It is very complex. Economics and education will help and we can close the gap but how do Aboriginal people retain their Aboriginality and their unique culture. Noel Pearson believes that Aboriginal people must be bi-cultural. What is Aboriginality? There is a view in certain sections of society that Aboriginals should be assimilated and eventually bred out. 01:10:43 Track 3 00:00 After his political career ended, Fred became a Research Fellow at the Graduate School of Management at UWA from 1993 to 1995. Fred was very disappointed that there was not more inter-Faculty co operation at UWA during this time. He discovered that he wasn’t an academic and prefers to do things. He was offered a part-time and then full-time position on the National Native Title Tribunal (1994-2000) . 05:27 He worries that PhD studies focus on a unique project that by nature are often narrow and of little value. He was a researcher at the School of Sciences at the ANU and was buoyed by their company and their collaborations. He believes that there are many different types of intelligence. 09:23 Fred’s study at UWA allowed him to grow and mature. It exposed him to many different ideas. He recognises the support of his wife Angela during his life and enjoyed immersing himself in university life. His education at Aquinas College was also significant to his future. 13:15 UWA has been an important institution for his children, grandchildren and nieces and nephews. He hopes that the university will continue to live up to its motto of “Seek Wisdom”. 15:01 Audio Files Links to audio files <a href="http://oralhistories.arts.uwa.edu.au/files/original/13b3eb18950a2c98337930dc04b448ca.mp3">Chaney_Fred, Interview 1, Track 1</a> <br /><a href="http://oralhistories.arts.uwa.edu.au/files/original/caeefd81b290090aa4f5e81a7a937ecf.mp3">Chaney_Fred, Interview 1, Track 2</a> <br /><a href="http://oralhistories.arts.uwa.edu.au/files/original/d287cdc1c8fbd0dd11a16154315dda5b.mp3">Chaney_Fred, Interview 1, Track 3</a> <br /><a href="http://oralhistories.arts.uwa.edu.au/files/original/be20236eb39ce4c5eb8e7d4658510c8b.mp3">Chaney_Fred, Interview 1, Track 4</a> <br /><a href="http://oralhistories.arts.uwa.edu.au/files/original/2be68de9462cf6e58358bce67cc38f17.mp3">Chaney_Fred, Interview 2, Track 1</a> <br /><a href="http://oralhistories.arts.uwa.edu.au/files/original/8d0653fd2d6b7c7b3fb01707335056ee.mp3">Chaney_Fred, Interview 2, Track 2</a> <br /><a href="http://oralhistories.arts.uwa.edu.au/files/original/fd1d23feae0d464a8aced5a258e2aa31.mp3">Chaney_Fred, Interview 2, Track 3</a> Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Fred Chaney interview, 11 September 2014 and 12 September 2014 Subject The topic of the resource Law Description An account of the resource Fred Chaney was born in Perth in 1941. He practised law in New Guinea and Western Australia, including time in-house with the Hancock-Wright prospecting partnership, and subsequent private practice with emphasis on mining related work until he entered the Senate in 1974. Fred was involved in the Aboriginal Legal Service in a voluntary capacity in the early 1970’s. He was in the Senate until 1990 and was Leader of the Opposition in the Senate from 1983 to 1990. He was Member for Pearce in the House of Representatives from 1990 to 1993. Among his Ministerial appointments were Aboriginal Affairs, Social Security and Minister Assisting the Minister for National Development and Energy. After leaving Parliament he undertook research into Aboriginal Affairs policy and administration as a Research Fellow with the Graduate School of Management at the University of Western Australia from 1993 to April 1995. He was appointed Chancellor of Murdoch University in 1995 and continued in that capacity until 2003. He is involved in Aboriginal education through the Graham (Polly) Farmer Foundation which he established at the request of Graham Farmer in 1995. In 1994 he was appointed as a part-time Member of the National Native Title Tribunal, a full-time Member in April 1995 and a Deputy President in April 2000 until 2007. He served as Co-Chair of Reconciliation Australia Ltd from 2000 to 2005 and continues as a Director on the Board. Mr Chaney was appointed Chair of Desert Knowledge Australia in 2005. In 2008 he was awarded the inaugural Sir Ronald Wilson Award for “exceptional leadership in the fields of social justice, human rights, equality and anti racism.” Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Chaney, Fred Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available University of Western Australia Historical Society Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource Copyright holder University of Western Australia Language A language of the resource MP3 files Type The nature or genre of the resource Oral History Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource UWA ORAL HISTORIES Description An account of the resource A collection of interviews with former UWA staff, recorded by the <a href="http://www.alumni.uwa.edu.au/community/historical-society" target="_blank">UWA Historical Society</a> to mark the Centenary of the University in 2013. <br />The UWA Historical Society’s <a href="http://www.alumni.uwa.edu.au/community/historical-society/oral-histories" target="_blank">Oral History Program</a> started as a project with four oral histories funded from Society resources. It was then expanded with support from every Faculty on campus, the Guild, Convocation and through private donations. Additional funding was received through a Heritage Grant. Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available University of Western Australia Historical Society Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource University of Western Australia Historical Society Oral History A resource containing historical information obtained in interviews with persons having firsthand knowledge. Interviewer The person(s) performing the interview John Bannister Interviewee The person(s) being interviewed Barry Marshall Duration Length of time involved (seconds, minutes, hours, days, class periods, etc.) Interview 1: 1 hour, 20 minutes, 26 seconds Interview 2: 1 hour, 10 minutes, 43 seconds Interview 3: 1 hour, 39 minutes, 7 seconds Total: 4 hours, 10 minutes, 16 seconds Bit Rate/Frequency Rate at which bits are transferred (i.e. 96 kbit/s would be FM quality audio) 128 kbs Time Summary A summary of an interview given for different time stamps throughout the interview Interview 1 Track 1 00:00:00 Barry James Marshall 1951 in Kalgoorlie hospital. Background information. Parents history. Bob and Dianne Marshall. Parents and grandparents marry young. Bellman at the Railway Hotel. Mother origins in Victoria. Brains come from mothers side. Fathers background. Stolen generation of white people. Parents, father, mother 00:04:50 Railway Hotel in Kalgoorlie was an exciting place. Winning the lotteries and the coming of the war. Grandmother and father buy a hotel. Mother is in Gwalia. Father was a rebel during the war. Father has a paper round. Father makes more money than most adults. Father gets in trouble with the law. Father goes on work release. Father, mother, hotel 00:10:40 Father ends up in Christian Brothers school. Father in Kalgoorlie and works in the railway yards. Rationing associated with housing. Grandfather comes up the hard way. grandfather 00:14:26 Earliest memories of childhood. Memories of Kalgoorlie. Memories of going to Rum jungle. Living in Carnarvon. Being exposed to whaling and brothers health issues. Sheep slaughtering. Impressions of technology. Fremantle and Kalgoorlie. Fathers hotels in Kalgoorlie. Coming back to Perth and building a house in Scarborough. Childhood, sheep, Fremantle Kalgoorlie Track 2 00:00:00 Fremantle was the end of the earth. Schooling in Kalgoorlie. Neighbours were an escaped Nazi. Learning to read. Being the top of the class. Other childhood memories of Kalgoorlie. Making money and memories of the horse races in Kalgoorlie. Kalgoorlie, money 00:04:39 Childhood of books and new technology. Childhood games and Guy Fawkes night. Loving school. Learning to respect your elders. Germs and infectious diseases at school. Mothers nursing. Books, new technology, nurse 00:09:36 New jobs in Perth. Moving to Scarborough. Building the family house. There was always someone better at school. Aspirations at school. Inquisitive. Thoughts of career. Sickness and reading. School, reading 00:13:50 Hungering after books. Reading manuals and Encyclopaedias and nursing books. Reading bout disease and medicine. Penicillin and antibiotics. Hygiene at the toilets at school and disease at school. Paranoid about hell and sin. Being well behaved. Hygiene, antibiotics, penicillin 00:18:45 Primary school and high school. Science books and Nobel laureates. Robin warren. Memories of being inspired to be a doctor. University aptitude test and Winthrop hall. Extended medical school at UWA. Dick Joskie* sees something in Marshall. University, Dick Joskie, Winthrop hall 00:24:40 Reputation of University of WA. Memories of Curtin university. Faculty of engineering and medicine. Interesting places at UWA. Engineering. Computing at Physics. Reputation of UWA, medicine 00:26:50 Working out how to break a high stressed beam. Wanting to prove people wrong. Transition from school to UWA. Struggling with maths at UWA. High level studies at UWA. Surviving the first year at UWA. Getting a scholarship for medicine. Completion at UWA. Scholarship, struggling 00:31:40 Studying intently at UWA. Being inspired to work at UWA. Brian Stokes. Lesley Callor*. Fabulous people at UWA. Don Watts* is a character. Physics and Chemistry was heaven. Mathematics was a little harder. Don watts, Brian Stokes, Lesley Callor 00:35:15 Student and senior lecturers. Medical school. Understand and learning. Examples of a T test. Memories of the left wing communists. Sue Boyd*. Memories of Prosh. Arts students were at the coffee shops. Student, senior lecturer, medical school 00:39:00 Learning anatomy from books. Not learning Botany and taxonomy. Focus on the hard core sciences. Writing research papers and test. Not involved in guild. Involved in the university regiment. Camps and training. Teaching junior recruits. Memories of the army. and memories of being able to teach. Learning from books, research papers, university regiment 00:44:00 Reputation and pride of being at UWA. Being as good as you could get. People come to WA from oxford and Cambridge. Professor Ten Seldan.* expansion of medical school. Concerns of passing the course. Competition at UWA. Lots of practical classes. Academics working hard at UWA. Ten Seldan, competition, medical school 00:50:30 Interests in gastroenterology. Barry Marshall and Prosh day. Not aware of hepatitis and blood squirting around at Prosh day. Medical school and specialising. Straight forward medicine. Prosh, gastroenterology 00:54:10 Memories of surgery. Really challenging parts of surgery. Surgery was like plumbing. Skills of knowing when someone is unwell or is getting better. Thoughts of future interests. Surgery, skills, interests 00:57:20 General surgery and brain stokes. Neurosurgery. Intensive internal medicine. Working hard and studying. Exciting prospects and getting interested in research. Not fitting in well with the academic life. Neurosurgery, research, not fitting in End 01:00:00 Interview 2 Track 1 00:00:00 Each year trying to do research. surgery and obstetrics. Taking to clinical jobs. Case reports. Heat stroke in marathon runners. Gastroenterology and Robin Warren. Tom Waters. Robin spots bacteria on biopsies. Meeting Robin Warren. Research project, Robin Warren, Tom Waters* 00:05:03 Serious pathologist. Robin happy to discuss bacteria. Stomach sterile and campylobacter. Looking at biopsies. Different strains and campylobacter. Chickens and campylobacter. Bacteria had been seen in the past. Thinking about the stomach and ulcers. Interesting research . Proving the medicals wrong. Robin finds more and more bacteria. Bacteria cant exist. Correct logic. Campylobacter, Bacteria, stomach and ulcers, Robin finds bacteria. Bacteria cant exist 00:11:35 Looking at the records and investigating patients. Stress associated with bacteria. Gastritis. National library of medicine literary search. Classifying gastritis. Descriptions of bacteria throughout history. People are ignoring the bacteria. The technology and biopsies. Culturing the bacteria. Failure to culture bacteria in 1981. Gastritis, ignoring the bacteria, biopsies, culturing the bacteria 00:17:11 Doing a proper study of 100 people. Questionnaires and research money. Support. Talking about the bacteria. Dr Lee. Getting closer to a successful culture. Studying 100 patients. Data and coding of findings and the study. Studying 100 patients, data, coding of findings, study, Dr Lee 00:21:37 Culturing the bacteria. Bacteria in the Petri dish are different. Everyone who has an ulcers and bacteria. Studying the literature and information of the stomach. Duodenal ulcers. Hypothesis of a duodenal ulcer. Fitting data together and the cause of peptic ulcers. Presenting to the case rounds in Port Hedland. Alan Eggleston the senator. Culturing the bacteria, ulcers and bacteria, Duodenal ulcers, Alan Eggleston* 00:27:38 Writing letters to the academics. Writing to the director of health Lawson Holman*. Writing an abstract for the college meeting. Sceptics of the hypothesis. Biopsy of gastritis. Len Matts.* bacteria grows in scopes. Pseudo minus. Weibo Fung, Chinese gastroenterologists. Discover of Helicobacter. Other people have skimmed over the bacteria and never made the discovery. Lawson Holman*, sceptics, gastritis, Len Matts,* Pseudo minus, Weibo Fung* 00:33:40 Wanting to go on with studying. John Pearman*. Ulcers one of the most charismatic disease. Microbiologists are interested in bacteria. The Mayo Clinic Ian Hislop*. D ulcers and gastritis. Respecting scientific technique. Getting work on campylobacter in Fremantle hospital 1983. Peter Smith. John Peerman, Ian Hislop, Peter Smith 00:37:27 Hitting the ground running. Submitted applications to tie up the loose ends. Writing an abstract for the Australian College of Gastroenterology. Finding a bacteria in the stomach was a complete yawn. Doing study with Ian Hislop*. Bismuth, antimony, arsenic. Curing bacteria with heavy metal. Bismuth had been used on stomach bacteria in the past. Ian Hislop, Bismuth, curing bacteria 00:43:00 Maximising value with Robin warren. Deciding to publish together. Writing two letters. Robin knows how important the discoveries are going to be. Publishing of theory and reviewers of theory. Cannot mention that bacteria causes ulcers. Barry and the study of patients. The junior partner. Robin Warren, Publishing of theory, bacteria causes ulcers, The junior partner 00:49:50 Failing at the Australian conference and presenting in the Brussels campylobacter conference. David McGechie*. Calling Martin Skirrow world campylobacter expert. Writing an abstract and getting funding from Fremantle Hospital. David McGechie, Calling Martin Skirrow Track 2 00:00:00 Off to Brussels. Fremantle was the right launching pad for Brussels. Travel grant on the cv. People were entreprenrial. Harvy Turner. Practicing the presentation. The next winner of the Americas cup Australia II. Marshall Blazer and ulcers cause all peptic ulcers. Martin Skirrow in Worcester*. Harvey Turner, Marshall Blazer, peptic ulcers, Martin Skirrow 00:04:00 Culturing the bacteria. Describing gastritis and bacteria. Guido Tricot*. Identifying the bacteria. People going crazy at the Amsterdam hospital. Discovering bismuth as cure. Gasprocardis* are excited. People switching into Helicobacter. Many people make their career out of Helicobacter. Guido Tricot, Gisprocardis 00:07:20 Naming of the bacteria. Campylobacter pyloridis. Winning the grand final and being heroes. Nothing better than you could do. Thinking of getting a Nobel prize. Bad luck. Projecting career and going to America. Working at Fremantle. Skirrow helps publication. Getting to know David Sharp*. David Sharp, Skirrow, heroes 00:14:24 Publishing the paper in the lancet. Ian Munroe*. Martin Skirrow going gang busters and independent reviewer. Editing the paper to publish. Being published in the Lancet*. Publishing, lancet, Skirrow Interview 3 Track 1 00:00:00 Publication in the Lancet. NHMRC funding. Modest funding request. International recognition. People testing out the theory. People make the same findings. Result of publication in the lancet. Publication in the Lancet, NHMRC funding, modest funding request, International recognition 00:04:10 1984 Final year of working in Fremantle hospital. Great results. Proving a pathogen. Trying to infect piglets. Problems and criticism. Decision to do a self experiment. Koch’s postulates. Getting nowhere with grants. Results of Bismuth* and Metronidazole. Secret combination. Getting over confident about curing Helicobacter. Pathogen, self experiment, Koch’s postulates, Bismuth* and Metronidazole, curing Helicobacter 00:08:57 Treatment results on patients. Proving the pathogen. Percentage of people with Helicobacter. Brewing up for a self experiment. Drinking the mix of bugs. Results of taking the mixture. Stomach becomes paralysed and nausea and vomiting. Bacteria in the biopsies. Treatment, Bacteria in the biopsies. 00:14:10 Robin warren is infected with Helicobacte Pylori. Memories of the experiment. Mother comments of bad breath. Results of endoscopy. Telling wife about the experiment. Results, experiment 00:18:50 Having endoscopy to find results and taking antibiotics. End of experiment. Self cured. Medical Journal of Australia a re disappointed. Campylobacter Pyloridus and gastro duodenal disease. Clinical finding from 1983-4. An attempt to fulfil Koch’s postulates for HB P. Self cured, Campylobacter Pyloridus and gastro duodenal disease. Clinical finding from 1983-4. An attempt to fulfil Koch’s postulates for Helicobacter Pylori 00:22:49 John Armstrong’s view of the paper An attempt to fulfil Koch’s postulates for HB P. historic evidence of gastritis and HB. William Mosley’s* book on of gastritis. Looking at all the medical books. John Armstrong 00:27:15 Searching through the literature for proof of infection with Helicobacter Pylori. Rewriting the results An attempt to fulfil Koch’s postulates for Helicobacter Pylori. Ian Hislop’s* opposition to the theory. Lancet response to the paper in the Medical Journal of Australia. journal very highly sited. People following up of the findings. Rewriting, Ian Hislop’s*, findings. 00:32:48 Procter and Gamble - Norwich. Peptobismol. Speaking in America and about bacteria. Getting job offers from America. Lecturing in Stanford and Dallas Texas. Procter and Gamble, Peptobismol 00:37:04 Comparing Tagamed and Zantac. The new paradigm. Harvey Turner and breath test. Funded by NHMRC. Working back with Robin Warren and Stuart Goodwin. Getting requests to write for journals. Job offer and Procter* and gamble. Licensing patents. Comparing Tagamed, Zantac, Harvey Turner, NHMRC, Robin Warren, Stuart Goodwin 00:43:03 Talking about going to America in 1986. Decade of development. Gaining Warren Alpert Prize. 1984 Australian findings. Presenting papers and talking to people. Result being tested around the world. Treating patients with Anti Biotics in Perth. Warren Alpert Prize 00:47:20 Working on people for a study. Blood test for ulcers. Going to a conference in America. Being funded by NHMRC. Fake process of the double blind study. Getting result of double blind study. Proof that the antibiotics work. 4 years where nothing much happens in clinical work. Blood test double blind study. Getting result of double blind study, proof Track 2 00:00:00 1998 everyone was against Marshall. 1988 and 1991 criticised by the sceptics. Pure double blind study Bismuth Tagamed Zantac, Metronidazole. Curing most of the helicobacter patients. Published in the new English journal. Gold standard credibility. Massachusetts medical society. Funded by proctor and gamble. Advertising scams. Peptobismol kills bacteria. Little articles in the popular press. People write to Warren and Marshall for advice. Thousands of people cured in the US. 1993 things are getting out of control consensus conference in 1994. 00:04:19 The process does take a long time. generic medications. Lack of resources. Billion drug companies selling ulcer treatments. Smith, Kline and French. Competing with acid blockers. Promotional research. Tagamed. Is Zantac 5% better than Tagamed. The cure rate. Taking tablets for ulcer treatment. People shying away from helicobacter. Not mentioning helicobacter treatment. Doctors don’t hear about the new paradigm that is being swamped. 00:07:38 No research into helicobacter. Talking about Warren alpert prize. Baker award lecture. The Paul Ehrlich Medal. The Florey Medal. Not understanding what was going on. Consensus conference and the treatment of helicobacter. The Ulcer Wars documentary and the word is getting out. The in thing. The junior guys move up through the ranks. 00:10:16 Breath test company and academic industry. Supplementing income with lecturing. Getting the word out to 1000s of patients. Sacrificing career developments. Being interviewed by CNN but no one has heard of it. Important new discovery and the Warren Alpert award. What does it mean to het a prize. A prize CV. Nominating for the Nobel prize. 00:14:20 Deciding to get the prize in 1986. Nothing has happened in 10 years. People nominate for the Nobel prize. Strain in America. Moving to Perth. Awarded the AMA Hippocratic award. The Florey medal from the scientific community is a great honour. 00:17:05 Thoughts and rumours for the NP. Having dinner each year for the Nobel Prize day each time. 2005 and Robin warren is called. Being called personally. Getting the news. Doing interviews around the world for 5 hours. 00:22:27 All hell breaks lose. Alan Robson and the hero of the university. The PM Science prize. Doing TV and press. Robin Williams Norman swan and Dr Carl. Memories of the award ceremony. 10 of December prize giving. 00:26:52 Scientific and media events. Giving speech and attending the king. The massive banquet. The speech is an issue. Stressful being the Nobel laureate. Meeting the king. Robin warren has medical issues and is taken to hospital. 00:29:59 Getting prizes to lead up to the award. The Nobel committee. Being recognised all around the world. The Buchannan Medal* and The Royal Society. Descent about the Nobel. How the Nobel has changed Marshalls life. Empowered by the Nobel Prize. Not worried about rejection. Seeing the value. Valuable to have a Nobel prize winner in you state and institutions. Validating research. 00:35:05 The Marshall centre is set up. Ondek.* maintaining the brand. Experts in different fields. NP will still be valued. Maintaining the prestige of the NP. Starting up a company relating to Helicobacter. Reason on evolution for HB. Hypo allergy. HB disappearing from western society. Research into pro-biotics. The answer to use bacteria. HB is hard to transmit. Change of lifestyle. Better of with HB in childhood. 00:38:55 Super vaccine for HIV and Bird flu. The office of the NL attracting attention to UWA. K Laurie at the office of the NL. 3 international invitations ever week. Writing to the PM and the Premier. Burnet* Fellowship at UWA and looking at work and career at UWA. Looking back at experience. A great spirit at UWA an Ivy league university. Helping to continue with becoming the top 50. Contributing to the university ratings. 00:45:05 End of interview Audio Files Links to audio files <a href="http://oralhistories.arts.uwa.edu.au/files/original/cc7729879ccc043af487571c28e66429.mp3">Marshall, Interview 1, Track 1</a> <br /><a href="http://oralhistories.arts.uwa.edu.au/files/original/0c6f295ee2314f791b9e5451a8415277.mp3">Marshall, Interview 1, Track 2</a> <br /><a href="http://oralhistories.arts.uwa.edu.au/files/original/161ed206282dd294fe8a10ba15ce10c7.mp3">Marshall, Interview 2, Track 1</a> <br /><a href="http://oralhistories.arts.uwa.edu.au/files/original/ffe0b56f6e359d1c4742a3ba660c5f9e.mp3">Marshall, Interview 2, Track 2</a> <br /><a href="http://oralhistories.arts.uwa.edu.au/files/original/a6c920f2f8c7a48383e537579a930d9c.mp3">Marshall, Interview 3, Track 1</a> <br /><a href="http://oralhistories.arts.uwa.edu.au/files/original/9ecdd746705cde00aa88787f2b370cc7.mp3">Marshall, Interview 3, Track 2</a> Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Barry Marshall interview, 25 June 2014, 20 August 2014 and 24 September 2014 Subject The topic of the resource Medicine Description An account of the resource Professor Barry Marshall, along with Emeritus Professor Robin Warren discovered Helicobacter Pylori as the cause of Stomach Ulcers. He and Robin Warren were awarded the Nobel Prize in Medicine and Physiology for their findings in 2005. During the interview Barry discusses his family background and interest in medicine. He talks of his experiences at UWA as a student, his developing career and ultimately his work in gastroenterology which would lead him to meet Robin Warren and to their initial findings in 1982. He mentions the difficult process of bringing their hypothesis that ‘ulcers were caused by helicobacter pylori’ to world attention. In 1984, following unsuccessfully trying to infect pigs, Barry proved his theory by self-testing. He drank a mix of Helicobacter, which caused dramatic infection within a few days. It would be 20 years before both he and Robin Warren would be awarded the ultimate prize for their discovery, The Nobel Prize. Barry talks of the years of gradual world recognition leading up to 2005 and being awarded the Nobel Prize; including his continued career and work in America being awarded the Warren Alpert Prize, The Paul Ehrlich Medal and The Florey medal among others. In looking at his education and career and awards to date, Barry speaks of what it means to him to be a Nobel Laureate. He looks at the University of WA and its place in the world and how he sees it as an institution of learning on the world stage. Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Marshall, Barry Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available University of Western Australia Historical Society Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource Copyright holder University of Western Australia Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource MP3 files Type The nature or genre of the resource Oral History Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource UWA ORAL HISTORIES Description An account of the resource A collection of interviews with former UWA staff, recorded by the <a href="http://www.alumni.uwa.edu.au/community/historical-society" target="_blank">UWA Historical Society</a> to mark the Centenary of the University in 2013. <br />The UWA Historical Society’s <a href="http://www.alumni.uwa.edu.au/community/historical-society/oral-histories" target="_blank">Oral History Program</a> started as a project with four oral histories funded from Society resources. It was then expanded with support from every Faculty on campus, the Guild, Convocation and through private donations. Additional funding was received through a Heritage Grant. Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available University of Western Australia Historical Society Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource University of Western Australia Historical Society Oral History A resource containing historical information obtained in interviews with persons having firsthand knowledge. Interviewer The person(s) performing the interview Julia Wallis Interviewee The person(s) being interviewed Rita Clarke Location The location of the interview Claremont, WA Duration Length of time involved (seconds, minutes, hours, days, class periods, etc.) Interview 1: 45 minutes, 46 seconds Interview 2: 41 minutes, 45 seconds Total : 1 hour, 27 minutes, 31 seconds Bit Rate/Frequency Rate at which bits are transferred (i.e. 96 kbit/s would be FM quality audio) 128 kbs Time Summary A summary of an interview given for different time stamps throughout the interview Interview 1 Track 1 00:00 Introduction by Julia Wallis 00: 35 Track 2 00:00 Rita and her husband John came to Australia in 1964. Rita’s brother was already living in Floreat. House was designed by the architect Peter Overman. They loved the lifestyle. 01:34 Rita was told that she could sit for a matured aged exam for the University of Western Australia. Rita hadn’t taken A levels because she wasn’t sure what she wanted to do but worked in France for a year. There was a general knowledge component, English plus an elected subject. Rita chose French. She passed and was accepted into a university degree. 02:08 Rita was working so she studied part-time. She took English, French, Philosophy and Music. The Music Department was headed by Professor Callaway and the department was located at Tuart House. Rita loved the course. Professor Callaway was trying to get all the graduates to come in and do at least one unit in music. He wanted the students to become music educators. Rita did music education. 02:57 Rita was going to major in music but had her first baby at the end of the third year. When she told Professor Callaway she was pregnant and would have to leave he said why and encouraged her to keep going. Rita gave birth to Philippa in September and David Tunley tutored her for what she had missed. Rita majored in English poetry and the novel. 04:00 It was a small university then. Rita was looked on as a matured aged student even though she was only 23. Most of the other students were 17 and hadn’t been out of Western Australia. They weren’t very worldly and enjoyed having the matured aged students in the tutorials. 04:29 Rita was living in Karrinyup by this stage so she didn’t spend much time on the campus. She finished her degree and had two more girls. 04:45 When her eldest daughter was about nine years old Rita decided to return to do a post graduate degree. A careers advisor at UWA suggested she try working for the campus radio. Rita had not realised that there was a radio station on campus. 05:05 In about 1984, Rita called into Radio 6UVS-FM and said she was interested in doing some radio work but was worried that she might be too old. However, the station manager at the time Pieta O’Shaughnessy was about the same age. They had just started an arts programme called “The Stupendous Stereo Stage Show”. Rita was asked to do some literary reviews and interviewing. Ann Tonks was running the programme with Barry Strickland. Barry Strickland has been on the Board of the Festival of Perth and is now on the Board of the Fringe Festival. Ann Tonks moved to the ABC and later managed the Melbourne Theatre Company. 05:59 Ann Tonks took over the management of Radio after Pieta O’Shaughnessy left. 06:05 Pieta was very encouraging. Rita did a few little things on morning programmes. Then she was given her own morning programme because she was fascinated with the science of radio broadcasting and wanted to learn how everything worked. 06:21 On her first breakfast programme somebody from the Centre of Water Research had invited a Professor from Cambridge to talk on the radio. Rita was given 5 minutes grace before she had to interview him. She discovered that what is interesting about a subject is the person doing the subject and how they became involved in the study. 07:15 Right from the start she had to think on her feet and she enjoyed doing this and found it very exciting. 07:27 Ann Tonks applied to manage Radio 6UVS-FM but was unsuccessful. The successful applicant was an American called Bill McGinnis. 07:51 Track 3 00:00 Before Pieta the radio station had been run on lines similar to the BBC. The focus was on current affairs and classical music. 00:34 Pieta tried to make it more popular and involve the students. There was a classical section. They promoted new bands and local talent. Then she started up the 4 hours evening arts programme which covered dance, concerts and so on. 01:03 Rita’s first interview was pre-recorded and was with Steven J Spears from the Rocky Horror Show. Rita had prepared a big list of questions and found this method stultified the interview and didn’t allow it to grow organically using interesting themes from his responses. 01:53 Interviewing one top Cambridge Don, his first answer opened up all sorts of options. After an initial feeling of panic, she decided to go with the last thread. She relished those moments because it made the job very exciting. 02:27 Other interviewees included Richard Harris, Harry Seycombe and Ronnie Corbett. The big stars wanted publicity when they were in Perth. Rita also interviewed Jane Campion at the beginning of her film career. 03:14 After Pieta left in about 1986, Ann Tonks applied for the job but they gave the job to an American called Bill McGinnis. Ann went off into other fields but came back later in 1997 to take over the reins. 03:36 Bill was more commercial and he decided that they should have sponsorship. He asked Rita if she would do the breakfast show. Rita had to get up at 4am as she had to drive in from Karrinyup. Her youngest daughter was 9 years old so the children were able to get themselves ready for school. Her husband was very supportive. As she became more familiar with the show she was able to leave later. This was made easier when they moved to 18 Everett Street in Crawley. 04:55 The radio station was located downstairs in some demountable buildings near the Faculty of Architecture. Rita would see some of the students leaving after working on projects for most of the night. Rita was alone in the building at 6am. When she had guests, they would ring the bell and she would put on some music while she went to collect them. One day the Vice Chancellor came on the radio and was unimpressed that she was working on her alone but nothing came of this. 06:27 Then it moved upstairs in the Sanders building in Myers Street. There was room to house the sponsorship worker, Dean. At one stage there was a waiting list for sponsors to get on the breakfast show. Many of car dealers wanted to be sponsors. 07:32 Olwyn Williams manage the classical music section. In the evenings lots of students came on and played their own type of music. Bill asked Rita to play rock n’ roll on the breakfast show. It was very popular. 08:39 Rita realised that guest speakers from the different Faculties at UWA provided a wealth of anecdotes and information. She suggested that the station produce a magazine but this idea was not taken up until the radio station was closed. Some of the academic wanted to have accreditation if they came on and did a series of programmes. Because this wasn’t accepted by the university, some of them declined to be interviewed. 10:25 Unfortunately the interviews weren’t saved and were taped over. There were big reel to reel tapes in those days. Rita has a few tapes and Dean took a lot when the station shut down. 10:46 Bill McGinnis started including promos. This was very new then. Bill left to take up a position with community television and Ann Tonks took over. Timothy West is appointed Director-in-Residence at UWA in 1982. He produced “Women beware women”. Ann Tonks played the main role. Rita was assistant stage manager. They got to know him and his wife Prunella Scales really well as they stayed here for a year. 13:23 Ann boosted the arts and the radio station would interview those taking part in the Festival of Perth. When she decided to leave in 1989. She joined the Australian Broadcasting Corporation as Station Manager of Radio National. Rita got in touch with the Australian newspaper and suggested that they do a piece on Ann. As they had no journalists to write the article, Rita wrote it and included one of her own photos (which she later realised was not the thing to do as they had sent an official photographer to do take the photo). 15:59 The station ran a competition for the best radio play and recorded it live at the Dolphin Theatre. 17:05 In those days everybody was doing everything themselves. Nobody had a producer. Towards the end of Rita’s time on the radio station she began to get producers – mainly from people who volunteered as they wanted to get into radio. 17:33 The breakfast programme was from 6am to 9am. Pieta did the breakfast programme for a while. When Pieta left, somebody else presented it for a while. After they left, Bill asked Rita to do it. Rita comments that you have to not mind being caught out when things go wrong. 18:22 Rita liked to ask different questions as she was well aware that celebrities had been asked the same questions by all the media. Rita asked Eric Bogle the folk singer if he was a breast fed baby. He later said that this was the best question he had been asked. 19:25 The West did an article about the breakfast show and asked Rita who she had interviewed. When the article was published, she was accused of being a name dropper. 19:53 Spike Milligan came for a pre-recorded interview in the evening. He said that he hated journalists as he considered them to be “full of themselves”. He said that Rita was all right but he supposed that nobody listened to this! 20:38 David Blenkinsop was Director of Perth International Arts Festival from 1975 to 1999. He was interviewed about the Festival and was annoyed that she did not attend the press conference. Rita had not been told about it. Luckily she was not taken aback by this and the interview went well. 21:24 Track 4 00:00 Ann was very strategic and a good manager. When the university decided to close down the radio station. Some of the university’s money had to spend on communication and community. Some of the money for the radio was also coming from Murdoch because they were training media students. 00:55 The pressure came about from the publication of the Dawkins Report in 1987 and universities were being rationalised. From this time, Rita felt that the university changed and people felt under pressure from cost cuts. 01:29 Ann suggested the eventual protest at the closing down of the radio station. They got a lot of publicity and saved the station. 02:19 Rita had been a volunteer for a long time. Pieta offered her a stipend of about $100 a month. When Bill arrived, he employed Rita as the breakfast announcer and producer and she got a regular wage. 02:50 After Ann left the job was advertised and it was offered to a charming young Englishman. He started a magazine up for the radio (not the whole campus). Alison Farmer was the editor. She did reviews for the West Australian. 04:33 He had the idea to get CD’s published of some of the music. He had good ideas but they did not have the resources to fulfil some of them. 04:52 The university were a little annoyed because they were trying to get money from outside sources at the same time as the radio station was seeking sponsorship. Other department were also trying to do this. Ultimately the university decided that all sponsorship had to go through the administration. 05:22 In 1990 they decided to close the radio station again. The new head of the radio was advised not to kick up a fuss and the station was closed down. 05:51 Some of people on the music side were especially keen to keep going. The university let them keep the area for a peppercorn rent but they had to change the name to 6RTR. It moved off the campus to Mount Lawley in January 2005. Rita was involved in the radio station from 1980 to 1990. It was a fantastic ten years. There was no leaving party for the station. 07:29 The last head of the radio station asked Rita would come off the breakfast show and do the afternoon arts show. A young girl came on the breakfast show and made it more music orientated. 08:36 Eoin Cameron was doing the breakfast show on the ABC. The ad for his show said “Have Breakfast with Eoin” and showed him in the shower with a shower cap on. Rita suggested that they should put out a rival ad saying “Wouldn’t you rather have breakfast with Rita”! 09:22 Like Eoin, Rita used to play a lot of comedy such as “Round the Horne” from BBC Radio 4 as well as snippets from “Fawlty Towers”. She also started reading “The Secret Diary of Adrian Mole aged 13 ¾”. One day the book disappeared and she could not read the book on air. There were so many phone calls from disappointed listeners. The publishers had been selling out of the book due to the demand. The booked appealed to both young and old. 10:55 At the time, there was nobody who tried to work out their audience figures. The different arts disciplines used to listen because the interviews were really meaty. There were no time constraints to fit it into a small slot. Presumably, the sponsorship officer would have to have had some idea of audience numbers to attract willing sponsors? 12:01 Rita had 3 children and was very busy so she was in and out and probably didn’t realise everything that went on in the office. 12:23 Towards the end the station had about 4 full time office staff. In addition to this there were lots of presenters. Older people came in and presented the nostalgia music programmes on Sunday mornings and played 30s and 40s music which had a big following. 13:13 Anybody could come in and suggest a programme. If it sounded interesting enough you could do it. Bridget Ross covered the visual arts. She and Rita did a programme in the morning “But thinking makes it so” which took a theme and covered different aspects of it. The programme won the Australasian Hi Fi prize for the most creative use of the medium. This was included in the campus brochure. Others won prizes for their music programmes. Rita went over to Melbourne to collect the prize. 14:22 They would do community announcement for UWA – for example promote the free concerts. If people told them about events, they would promote them. The Medieval Society would come on and talk about what they did. One of the people in the Medieval Society did theatre reviews. Rita often used people from the English department to go and see shows and review them. John Rapsey did the film reviews on the breakfast programme. People also came on and did book reviews. There was also a West Australian book programme. Olwyn would play on air certain pieces that the Music Department were playing. 15:55 Interview 2 Track 1 00:00 Introduction by Julia Wallis 00:30 Track 2 00:00 Rita studied English under Colin O’Brien. He was an expert on Shakespeare. She did Hamlet as her main study. Tom Gibbons tutored her in 3rd year and told her class that they couldn’t write essays. 03:16 The novels they had to study were the classics such as “Middlemarch” by George Elliott and James Joyce. The poets studied were Hardy, Keats and Yeats. Rita attended Yeats Summer School in Sligo after she left the radio. She wishes that she had been able to be on campus more. 15:15 Patrick Hutchings used to wear his gown to lectures. He later converted to Catholicism. 05:53 The French study was tough as you had to read and write in French. Rita studied Baudelaire and Rambaud. 06:24 Rita also studied music education. 06:32 The arts department was in its present location. The Fortune Theatre was pioneered by Colin O’Brien. The peacocks seem to watch and critique the plays. 07:45 At the time there was no drama section in the English department. 08:12 Rather than themes, the novels were studied for point of view and tone. 09:11 The music department had a similar method of contrast and compare composers for their essays. You had to work really hard to get good marks. 10:30 Track 3 00:00 At the radio station there were technicians who helped with pre-recorded interviews. They would help people who were interested in learning the ropes and how to edit. When she was on air with somebody she watched how they did it. 01:32 When you were presenting your own show you were left alone and had no help so you had to know what you were doing. Bill encouraged his staff to preserve the mystique of radio. At one time Rita edited something while she was on air. You were always able to get help and tuition if you needed it. 03:08 There were two tape machines and two turntables. The promos could be aired while you had a break. 03:39 Rita would get to the station at 6am or earlier when she was presenting the breakfast programme. She would play the news from London first up and snippets from Deutsche Welle. It was too early to do live interviews so she would play some comedy and music and perhaps a pre-recorded interview. There was no talk back. Rock n roll records were 2-3 minutes. 04:48 One morning she was quite ill as she had been out the night before and had had champagne and oysters. She had to play records while she ran to the bathroom! She had to call Olwyn to come and take over for the last half hour. She generally used to go back to the UK for Christmas or to Rottnest and Moira Martin would take over. Apart from holidays, she didn’t miss many (if any) radio shows. 05:58 The show would be planned in time segments but a lot of it was off the cuff as she didn’t have a producer. It wasn’t a commercial station so they didn’t have ads coming in. People came in to talk after 7am. News bulletins took about 10 minutes. Michael Bosworth came on to talk about Alexander the Great for example. There were some regulars one of whom as Colin who did “News from Nowhere”. Patrick O’Brien (Political Science) used to come on and was very lively and provocative. 08:21 The show always ended with a record so there was no chance that it would run into the next segment and it gave the presenters time for the change over. 09:07 The show had a good following and received a great deal of sponsorship. People liked being on university radio as it had integrity and reached a wide audience. The radio station had interesting guests and was very ethical. They considered themselves to be like the ABC. Radio is good for tapping into the imagination. 12:00 The ABC didn’t consider them as a rival radio station even though they often contributed to Radio National. In hindsight it is a wonder that the ABC didn’t have a stronger collaboration with Radio 6UVS-FM. Many of the Festival performers would be interviewed by both stations. Spike Milligan’s interview was quite long because he talked about a lot of interesting things such as growing up in India. Radio 6UVS-FM was able to play long interviews if they wanted to and weren’t confined by programming issues. 14:29 Many of the presenters from 6UVS-FM would later be picked up the ABC such as Jane Figgis. Rita was asked to do an interview with the ABC when they had a vacancy but at the time she was very happy where she was. Martin Marshall also went to the ABC. He was very excited when he had to interview the Pointer Sisters. He now runs the Good Store in Victoria Park. He married Olwyn Williams. Barry Strickland went to the ABC for quite a while and is now on the board of the Fringe Festival. 18:03 The radio station attracted very talented people. It was a very creative atmosphere at the station. 19:02 Track 4 Discussion of interview tapes 00:00 Stephen Daldry, Director from the Royal National Theatre, came over for the Perth Festival in 1995 with “An Inspector calls”. 00:34 Jerzy Sikorski, bone specialist, 1995 talks about hospitals being the new cathedrals 00:55 Sam Pickering, American essayist, 1993 01:15 Did a series of interviews for Radio National on Yeats Summer School in Sligo on a scholarship from the Irish Australian Society. 02:01 Sam Wannamaker c1990 talking about the need to save the Globe Theatre in London. 02:47 Jonah Jones, Moet & Chandon, 1992. He was here to give an art prize at the Art Gallery of WA. 03:14 Tim Winton (writer), Robert Juniper (artist) and photographer Richard Woldendorp, 1999. 03:57 Brian Bosworth talks on Alexander the Great in 1993. 04:15 Rita did a series of interviews on beach culture for the Australian Relationships including the Snake Pit at Scarborough in March 1989. 05:04 Off-air breakfast recording and an interview on Sex and Relationships. 06:02 Beach culture from neck to knee to nude. The world in a grain of sand. 06:24 Fiona Shaw (who played Harry Potter’s aunt Petunia) came over to Perth with director Deborah Warner for the Angel Project. 06:56 Science Bookshop was put on by other presenters at the radio station. 07:09 Anthony Lawrence poet. 07:31 English actor Martin Shaw 1983. Professor Callaway, May 1993 07:48 The Royal Philharmonic Orchestra, Clerkenwell, London, 1991. 08:05 Off air breakfast interviews with Graham Blundell, Spike Milligan, Professor Basil Sansom and Graham Rapsey (film reviewer). 08:25 Track 5 00:00 Rita was very grateful that she went to the radio station as it brought together her interests and expertise. She learned to be a radio journalist, producer, presenter, feature writer and critic. She wrote articles for the Australian and the Financial Review. She also wrote articles for the West Australian. 02:52 She is grateful to the university and the radio station. It was an exciting vibrant time. 03:18 Audio Files Links to audio files <a href="http://oralhistories.arts.uwa.edu.au/files/original/348bdc901ad121ad005148d609886a7d.mp3">Clarke, Interview 1, Track 1</a> <br /><a href="http://oralhistories.arts.uwa.edu.au/files/original/c8cb697d3b8b8d0afacf35c2a9e7d426.mp3">Clarke, Interview 1, Track 2</a> <br /><a href="http://oralhistories.arts.uwa.edu.au/files/original/957609478b5ee46153b97d236779c301.mp3">Clarke, Interview 1, Track 3</a> <br /><a href="http://oralhistories.arts.uwa.edu.au/files/original/92cffc027af1c9cf60644acd91ace5cb.mp3">Clarke, Interview 1, Track 4</a> <br /><a href="http://oralhistories.arts.uwa.edu.au/files/original/042219c1720a03f0cfa33e973fa96839.mp3">Clarke, Interview 2, Track 1</a> <br /><a href="http://oralhistories.arts.uwa.edu.au/files/original/5afea2a7c79420a5b11497bf68fb5fa6.mp3">Clarke, Interview 2, Track 2</a> <br /><a href="http://oralhistories.arts.uwa.edu.au/files/original/faf3b10016dc0a38b548c8f29de7d674.mp3">Clarke, Interview 2, Track 3</a> <br /><a href="http://oralhistories.arts.uwa.edu.au/files/original/e4893d6c97e99e336671c153ca886b8a.mp3">Clarke, Interview 2, Track 4</a> <br /><a href="http://oralhistories.arts.uwa.edu.au/files/original/e0ebf54c424382438f24efac4ff1fa63.mp3">Clarke, Interview 2, Track 5</a> Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Rita Clarke interview, 27 January 2014 and 3 February 2014 Subject The topic of the resource 6UVS FM Description An account of the resource Born Rita Cannon in Pembury, Kent in the UK in 1940. She worked in London and Paris. Rita married John Clarke in 1964 and came to Australia as a £10 Pom. Her brother and sister-in-law, John and Sylvia Cannon were already living in Perth. They liked the weather and the laid-back life-style so they made their lives here. They spent one year (1969) living in Sydney where Rita studied at Macquarie University. They had three daughters, Philippa, Katie and Laura. Rita began studies at UWA in 1965. Both Philippa and Laura are UWA graduates, Katie graduated from Murdoch University. A UWA arts graduate, Rita started work in a voluntary capacity for the campus radio station, 6UVSFM, having been invited to work on The Stupendous Stereo Stage Show produced at that time by Ann Tonks. She did arts reviews and interviews, and then also had her own morning program. In about 1985 she was asked by the Station Manager, Bill McGinnis to become full-time breakfast presenter and producer for the radio, whilst still fronting the Arts Show, for which she received a salary. She was also Talks Producer for the Radio. Whilst working for 6UVSFM, she did free-lance programs for the ABC, began writing feature articles and reviews for The Australian Newspaper and later The Financial Review (both at the same time). She wrote in this capacity for The West Australian and Scoop and various other magazines. She also edited Coo-ee! The WA Country Arts monthly Newsletter. Rita left the radio station when it closed down in 1990 and was elected to the Council of Convocation where she wrote Convocation’s pages in Uniview. She continued journalism and is on, or has been on, the judging panels for Theatre and Dance Awards. She now also teaches English as a Second Language. Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Clarke, Rita Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available University of Western Australia Historical Society Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource Copyright holder University of Western Australia If you wish to use information from this oral history recording in any public form, written or spoken, you must obtain permission from the person concerned (or their family). Please send your request to UWAHS. Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource MP3 files Type The nature or genre of the resource Oral History Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource UWA ORAL HISTORIES Description An account of the resource A collection of interviews with former UWA staff, recorded by the <a href="http://www.alumni.uwa.edu.au/community/historical-society" target="_blank">UWA Historical Society</a> to mark the Centenary of the University in 2013. <br />The UWA Historical Society’s <a href="http://www.alumni.uwa.edu.au/community/historical-society/oral-histories" target="_blank">Oral History Program</a> started as a project with four oral histories funded from Society resources. It was then expanded with support from every Faculty on campus, the Guild, Convocation and through private donations. Additional funding was received through a Heritage Grant. Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available University of Western Australia Historical Society Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource University of Western Australia Historical Society Oral History A resource containing historical information obtained in interviews with persons having firsthand knowledge. Interviewer The person(s) performing the interview John Bannister Interviewee The person(s) being interviewed Joan Pope Duration Length of time involved (seconds, minutes, hours, days, class periods, etc.) Interview 1: 55 minutes, 17 seconds Interview 2: 23 minutes, 19 seconds Interview 3: 55 minutes, 3 seconds Total: 2 hours, 13 minutes, 39 seconds Bit Rate/Frequency Rate at which bits are transferred (i.e. 96 kbit/s would be FM quality audio) 128 kbs Time Summary A summary of an interview given for different time stamps throughout the interview Interview 1 00:00:00 Dr Joan Pope. Background information. Memories of brother at UWA St. George's College. Exciting times watching Catalinas on the Swan River from the St. Georges Tower. Memories of the Winthrop hall tower. Trolley bus seen from. University towers, St George’s College, 00:02:58 Going to do music exams at the Chancellor's room. Meetings at the chancellor’s room. Sir Frank Callaway. First Music student in Arts 1954. Changing faculties to do music. Brother was not called up for War Service. Arts student, Sir Frank Callaway, music 00:05:39 Concerts at Winthrop Hall. Father and the combined choir. Mother and starting music. Memories of the university. Dorothy Fleming and dance classes in the 1940s. Revived Greek dance and creative use of the body. Winthrop Hall, Dorothy Fleming, dance classes 00:07:32 Dancing in The Sunken Garden. Long connection of UWA and looking at the way University of Western Australia was being run. A peaceful and orderly place. Passes to access the University buildings and the Americans. Nancy S1ewart and psychology. Pope experimented on at the Irwin street buildings as a child. The Sunken Garden, Nancy Stewart, Irwin Street Building 00:10:20 Impressions of the Irwin St building. Only 250 girls doing leaving school exams. Tiny place. Memories of struggling to find way through UWA. Involved in 20 plays and Prosh. Experience of trip to England in the coronation year. Wearing casual clothes at UWA. Joan in the Daily News. Breaking traditions of UWA girls. Irwin St building, plays and Prosh 00:14:30 Meeting Professor Callaway and music and Dalcroze Eurhythmics. Knocking on the door of the vice-chancellor and speaking to the professorial board. Frank Callaway's alternative view. Seeing UWA from an arts point of view. Memories of Josh Reynolds and the college plays. Professor Fox. Interesting experiments in Psych. Loved being there. Involved in many societies. Callaway, Josh Reynolds, Dalcroze Eurhythmics, Professor Fox 00:18:10 Starting the Fencing Club and Lou Klepac * and the weightlifting club. Guild and Societies council. Mrs Hazlehurst and Mrs. McGowan. Organising things for students. Memories of playing Lady Godiva in Prosh. Members of the staff. Bert Buttle* and Mr [George) Munns. People have loyalty to the place. First hearing of Convocation. Getting involved in organisation. Two women on Guild. Giving a Socrates* speech and getting onto Guild council. Coming involved in council and the Machiavellian undertones. Fencing Club, Guild, Mrs. Hazlehurst*, Mrs. McGowan*, Prosh, staff, Bert Buttle*, Mr Munns, Convocation 00:22:52 Getting involved and restrictions. The guild council would go on for a long time. Reps from The Senate at the Guild council meetings. Miss Jean Rogerson* Warden of Convocation. Conversation and the calling together of interesting elders. Getting the prize of Convocation. Including of the governance of the university. Convocation, Jean Rogerson, governance 00:22:52 Early impressions of Jean Rogerson*. Pale and not given to a lot of talking. A figure to be noticed. The Crawley Magazine. Honoured to be the 3rd female Warden of Convocation. Dr Roberta Jull. And ‘The’ Miss Rogerson .A great honour of being Warden. Warden of Convocation, Jean Rogerson, Roberto Jull 00:28:00 Working way through UWA and memories and understanding of Convocation. Convocation did not have a place. Convocation was and still is invisible. Irwin street building and Convocation pavilion. Impressions of understanding Convocation. Joining committees. Kit [Katherine) Gray and Dorothy Ransom. Active in community activities. Irwin St, Kit Gray, Dorothy Ransom, Convocation 00:33:00 Part time work and WAIT. Physical education. Sessonal teaching. Committees and Advisory Committee for Aged Services. Committee of Convocation wasn't like any other committee. Number of different agendas. Were or were not aligned with others. Subterranean things. What was Convocation was there for. Representative body of graduates. Subscription base. Representative body, committees, agendas 00:38:40 Why didn't it have any money. Convocation as a body and disinterest. Initiatives and subscription base. Elections. Numbers of people that vote for Convocation. Charming people on Convocation. Silberstein and Priest. Older and younger people. A lot of puzzles associated with Convocation. Silberstein, Priest, elections, subscription 00:43:17 Impressions of sustaining Convocation. Clerk of Convocation and the governance of Convocation. Deputy warden to Bruce James. Secretary of Convocation June Blake*. Keeping records for whom and for what. Looking at records. The West Australian reports about the Convocation. Convocation views on Endowment lands. Convocation has a duty on the statutes. Dawkins* revolution and the Hetherington report. Numbers on senate. Implications for senate. Bruce James, June Blake, Dawkins, Hetherington* 00:47:42 Women on committees. Which committees have a say so. On Senate as an observer. Meetings and the standing committee. Meeting an extraordinary number of interesting people. Women, committees, Senate 00:49:29 Grey area for needs of the graduates. Things that worked in Convocation. Practical things that grabbed people. Lead up to the 75th anniversary. Plaque and the Irwin St building. The events committee and America’s Cup. Sitting on the art collection board. Holmes a Court, Heymans*. The Lawrence Wilson Gallery. Mallor's* money and Bob Smith. Raising money for the Art Gallery. Memories of painting ducks for money. Juniper and Haynes. The alumni association was a bone of contention. Trevor Wigney*. Getting big bickies from the alumni. 75th anniversary, Irwin St building, Lawrence Wilson Gallery, Mallor's*, painting ducks for money, The Alumni Association, Trevor Wigney* Interview 2 00:00:00 Alumni Association with lots of finance. Alumni send a chill through the members of the standing committee. Vice chancellors like control over fundraising activities. Guild presidents Bob Nicholson* and David McKinlay* Professor Clyde. Trevor Wigney*. Senate pro the idea setting up something. Major fund raising set up through and the Hackett foundation and the Office of Development. Convocation and making bridges and working together. Voluntary service and the Hetherington* Report. Electing 6 senate members by Convocation. Alumni Association, Bob Nicholson*, David McKinlay*, Trevor Wigney*, Senate, Hackett foundation, Office of Development. Convocation, Hetherington* Report 00:03:30 Somerville announces that Convocation is a sluggish moribund body. The vision and the Somerville auditorium. Fred Alexander and the Adult Education Board. University revue and the Winthrop hall and the auditorium. The roman word auditorium seems like a strange word to use in the Australian bush. Somerville, Fred Alexander, Winthrop Hall 0:06:00 By 1980 nothing much has changed. Convocation a play thing for a few members. People on Convocation and thoughts regarding other committees. Doing things in a commemorative fashion. Rie Heymans. Convocation and the Friends of the Art Gallery. Bruce James was a Sunday painter. James Watson an art collector. Idea of the Friends of the gallery and the Senate's Art Collection Committee. Committees, Rie Heymans*, Bruce James, James Watson, Senates Art Collection Committee. 00:08:30 Deputy warden and memories of other wardens. Bruce James. Convocation and the Friends of the library and Prof Silberstein. Convocation and finance for the historical society. Irwin street building and preservation for practical purposes. The fairy steps at the Sunken Garden and landscaping of the steps by Jean Brodie-Hall*. War time demountables and the Irwin St buildings. Festival of Perth and John Birman* and the Adult Education Board. 1953 Festival of Perth runs out of the old buildings. Bruce James, Prof Silberstein, Irwin street building, Jean Brodie Hall*, Festival of Perth, John Birman*, Adult Education Board 00:12:14 Rescuing parts of the buildings. Entrance hall and the vice chancellors office and senate room and library. Convocation and the cost of moving and restoring the old building. Asking graduates for money. University and the alumni association and finance. Working parties set up to draw up a list of graduates. 4000 names turn into 10000 names for an appeal. Subcommittees working for a purpose. Publicity and promotion. Senate room, money, alumni association, working for a purpose. 00:16:11 Bob Hawke was accosted at a cricket match. White-anting going on. Exciting projects and the Irwin street building and graduates. Kath Gordon and Annie Anderson, Miss Burgess and people who had been heads of departments. Donations and personal relationship stuff happening. Making contacts and friendships in Perth. Development and finance and initiatives that were taken. Hard to get staff to run committees and minutes. No memory bank. Difficult times with staff. Bob Hawke, Kath Gordon, Annie Anderson, Miss Burgess, staff 00:19:56 Furthering the work of the university in the community. Extension service and adult education and outreach into the community. Linking work of UWA more closely with Convocation. Things have become more rigid. Involving voluntary committees with great ideas and changes in Convocation. outreach into the community, voluntary committees Interview 3 00:00:00 Memories of Convocation in the 1980s. Gathering more people around Convocation. The official meetings and disappointing numbers. Small functions. Tapping into people. Maintain contacts friend raising and fundraising. 25 and 50th anniversaries and reunions. Hackett scholarships, travelling P and O scholarships. Getting people together for a particular purpose. Encouragement awards. Push for postgraduate awards. Meetings, friend raising, fund raising, anniversaries, Hackett Scholarships, travelling scholarships, awards. 00:05:35 Deans came in academic dress. Memories of wearing gowns. Relaxed and formal. Being deputy and becoming warden. Bruce James and James Watson. Being nominated. West Australian women's fellowship. The art gallery and art collection board. Molly Roberts and Patrick Cornish. Convocation has its own magazine. Volunteers and staff. deputy warden, Bruce James, James Watson, West Australian Women's Fellowship, Molly Roberts,* Patrick Cornish staff 00:08:50 The Crawley and the UniView. Having your own magazine and rubbing people up the wrong way. Hew Roberts. The lack of corporate memory. Pauline Tremlett trying to catch pieces from the minutes. Events and lunches in the city. Connections with the guild. The Crawley, UniView, Hew Roberts*, corporate memory, Pauline Tremlett, Guild 00:12:30 Lack of gatherings. Jean Rogerson* and the trip to China. Plans for resuscitation. Bob Smith moving to have alumni. AUGC Australian University Graduates conference. Not all universities have Convocation. Universities viewing each other. People on convocation who have grand ideas. Jean Rogerson, alumni, AUGC Australian University Graduates conference 00:16:15 Trying to raise funds for graduates. Travelling. Award brings dream closer. International children's theatre .Awards and accolades. Involved on sub committees. Hoping to contribute to the centenary. Involved again on the lunch reunions. Looking through the records. Funds, awards, sub committees 00:19:30 Antagonistic feelings in the committees. Handling people on the committee. Men didn't like having women in the chair. The Crawley editorial subcommittee. New names and a blocked vote. Convocation replaces the warden via announcement via the Newspaper. women in the chair, Convocation replaces the warden 00:25:39 Withdrawing the nomination. Acting like local government. Helping graduates and representing graduates voice. Graduates elected to the senate. Representing views. Chancellors and graduates of the university. Reporting back to the current council. Withdrawing, graduates voice, graduates 00:28:20 Collaboration with the post graduates association. Convocation could help in a way. Assisting with post graduate enquiries and work placements. Mentorship. Needing more staff. Calling on past graduates to help with placements. Lack of staff and the growth of graduates. Collaboration, graduates association, mentorship 00:31:49 Convocation today and interaction with other universities. Sharing ideas. Wishing Convocation had more staff and it own building. Staff and money is a huge inhibitor. Conscious of the changes. Changing the title Trying to describe to people that it was the graduate's association. People are confused as member of Convocations and association. Sharing ideas. Wishing Convocation had more staff and its own building. Staff, graduate's association 00:36:50 Wish that they wouldn't call themselves the graduates association. The Convocation of UWA graduates. Email and change. Voting on line. Barriers and hurdles first. Pauline Tremlett and Unison*. Getting organisations and network and societies of the university to be aware of each other. Being proactive. Money. Pauline Tremlett, Unison* 00:40:21 Abundant evidence of money being spent on ideas that will go belly up. Important people and groups on Convocation .The loyal women. Putting energy into a committee. People with the time to give. Retired professors, academics and fellows. Money, loyal women, fellows 00:43:45 Particular role for people who have had staff associations. Losing contact with some. Coming back to Convocation. Trying to come to meetings. Stoush about the Alan Robson and endowment lands bushlands. staff associations, meetings 00:48:18 Being involved and seeing UWA without Convocation. Sense of a role of its history. Overseas graduates. Events held in faraway places. Convocation representatives on the team. Turning up on graduate nights. Overseas graduates, Convocation representatives, graduate nights 00:51:30 Upgrading website. Convocation is not high in the list. Balance between office of development and office alumni relations. Swamping Convocation. Intra state and interstate. Convocation gathering together like-minded bodies. The world is geared to marketing. Convocation marketing itself. Convocation needs to be a chameleon*. alumni relations, marketing Audio Files Links to audio files <a href="http://oralhistories.arts.uwa.edu.au/files/original/7f53c90530f57762c0061684f57a15e8.mp3">Pope, Interview 1, Track 1</a> <br /><a href="http://oralhistories.arts.uwa.edu.au/files/original/8567eecc3bf832c0a1ce94eb6ace4d7e.mp3">Pope, Interview 1, Track 2</a> <br /><a href="http://oralhistories.arts.uwa.edu.au/files/original/daf90977039bfacd112ea88aae9df42c.mp3">Pope, Interview 2, Track 1</a> Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Joan Pope interview, 26 October 2011 and 2 November 2011 Subject The topic of the resource Music Description An account of the resource Dr Joan Pope OAM, Dalcroze Australia President, holds the Diplôme Superieur of the Institut Jaques-Dalcroze, Geneva and has influenced a generation of teachers, artists and performers through her teaching of music and related arts in Western Australian universities. She has given Dalcroze workshops around Australia and south-east Asia. Joan has been on many national and international committees for dance, theatre, music and physical education and in 2001 was awarded the Medal of the Order of Australia and the Centenary of Federation Medal for her contributions to creative arts in the community which included initiating Festivals for Children, Children’s Activities Time Society, Playgrounds on Demand and AYPAA, the Australian Youth Performing Arts Association. Joan is an Hon. Life member of AUSDANCE, a Fellow of ACHPER, and served as Dance Co-ordinator for WA, and on the National Board for a number of years, in addition to her participation with the ACHPER Nursing Homes recreation project. A former Warden of Convocation, The University of WA honoured her with the Chancellor's Medal. She completed doctoral studies at Monash University in 2008 researching the teaching of Dalcroze Eurhythmics in Australia and New Zealand between 1918 and 1929. Joan has served on the Heather Gell Dalcroze Foundation as a Trustee, and published several books on the 'Music Through Movement' life and lessons of Heather Gell with the assistance of the former Callaway Resource Centre for Music Education at the School of Music UWA. Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Pope, Joan Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available University of Western Australia Historical Society Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource Copyright holder University of Western Australia Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource MP3 files Type The nature or genre of the resource Oral History Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource UWA ORAL HISTORIES Description An account of the resource A collection of interviews with former UWA staff, recorded by the <a href="http://www.alumni.uwa.edu.au/community/historical-society" target="_blank">UWA Historical Society</a> to mark the Centenary of the University in 2013. <br />The UWA Historical Society’s <a href="http://www.alumni.uwa.edu.au/community/historical-society/oral-histories" target="_blank">Oral History Program</a> started as a project with four oral histories funded from Society resources. It was then expanded with support from every Faculty on campus, the Guild, Convocation and through private donations. Additional funding was received through a Heritage Grant. Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available University of Western Australia Historical Society Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource University of Western Australia Historical Society Oral History A resource containing historical information obtained in interviews with persons having firsthand knowledge. Interviewer The person(s) performing the interview Julia Wallis Interviewee The person(s) being interviewed Daryl Williams Location The location of the interview Perth, W.A. Duration Length of time involved (seconds, minutes, hours, days, class periods, etc.) Interview 1: 1 hour, 11 minutes, 5 seconds Interview 2: 57 minutes and 52 seconds Interview 3: 49 minutes, 19 seconds Total: 2 hours, 58 minutes, 16 seconds Bit Rate/Frequency Rate at which bits are transferred (i.e. 96 kbit/s would be FM quality audio) 128 kbs Time Summary A summary of an interview given for different time stamps throughout the interview Interview 1 Track 1 00:00 Introduction by Julia Wallis 00:41 Daryl Robert Williams. Born 21 August 1942. Educated at Richmond State School, East Fremantle. (1948-1954). Learnt the piano from the age of 5-20. Walked to school often barefoot. Many waterside workers lived in the area and there were few children at school on the day of the Lumpers’ Picnic. Enjoyed school and sport. Very keen at mental arithmetic. Class size in Year 7 was 47 pupils. Head boy in final year at school. Enjoyed making speeches on Parents’ Night that he learned by heart. Sat for a scholarship to Perth Modern School in his final year. Was third in the State. Attended Presbyterian Sunday School 5-14. Became church organist aged 14. Travel to Perth Mod. The school had a high reputation. Boys and girls attended separate classes. The girls’ skirt lengths were inspected each morning. 07:41 The Leaving Certificate was 7 subjects. Also did one term of French and Geography until 3rd Year. Other subjects were English, German, History, Maths A, Maths B, Physics and Chemistry. Impressed by Robert Menzies and began to think about working in Government. The students were very competitive. No P&C Association. Parents invited to school only for the annual Sports Day. School captain in last year. Still friends with the other prefects. One of two students in Perth to gain 7 distinctions in 7 subjects in Leaving Certificate. Three possibilities to study at UWA – mathematics, law or medicine. Felt law would be a better route to getting into government. 15:11 Attended an orientation day. Addressed in Winthrop Hall by Professor Mervyn Austin (partly in Latin). Gained a scholarship to St Georges College. Consulted Warden Josh Reynolds (lectured in History Department). Awarded FW Simpson prize for best leaving certificate that year and also an Exhibition. Rooms in college allocated on basis of seniority. Communal bathrooms. Junior common room, tutors’ common room, impressive dining hall and chapel. Attendance at Matins and evening service not compulsory. Played organ for Matins once a week. Two resident tutors but none in law. Visiting tutor came once a week. First tutor was Alan James Barblett. Formal dinners with gowns. 1st year students initiated by 2nd years. Ponding. 25:51 Raids on other colleges – particularly on Sir Thomas More next door. St Catherine’s college for women was already established (1928). Inter college sports. Cross country run through Kings Park. Played hockey every Saturday at university and also interstate. Met future wife on inter Varsity debating trip to Brisbane. No trips in 2nd or 4th year. 28:42 Law School in prefab building adjacent to Fairway. Two lecture rooms, library and common room for Blackstone Society. Teaching not very satisfactory. Full-time lecturers supplemented by part-time legal practitioners. Frank Beasley’s last year was 1963. Eric Edwards taught evidence and criminal law. Ernest Kingston Braybrook taught torts. Ian McCall taught family law and international law. David Alan taught legal history and equity. Dai Davies taught contract and mercantile law. The part timers included Francis Burt, John Toohey, and John Wickham (Conflict). The part-timers were quite distinguished. The full time teachers deluged the students with suggested reading material. Tutorials were only before exams. Frank Beasley taught Constitutional Law. 34:27 20 units needed to complete the degree: 4 in first year and 2 arts subjects. First year more history of law. Second year to fourth year all law subjects. 5 subjects in 2nd and 3rd year and 6 subjects in final year. Designed to give a broad legal education. Second highest intake in 1960. Some people failed first year. There was no Honours year. You had to be invited to do Honours and had to do a test. DW chose contract. Oral examinations. Law Library. Lectures not recorded. There were lecture notes prepared by students in previous years. Students used notes by Malcolm McCusker and David Malcolm (both of whom graduated in the early sixties.) 44:20 Social life. Female law students. Sports Council and Guild Council. Students went to Steve’s Hotel and the Captain Stirling Hotel. Blackstone Society annual dinner. Lots of women in the Arts faculty. Students socialised at the Refectory in the Hackett Hall building. 49:19 Relationship with other Faculties. Rivalry between law and engineering. Sporting rivalry and raids. Fred Chaney kidnapped and welded to a railway line. Annual tug of war. Elected Secretary of Hockey Club. Became President of Sports Council. The President of the Sports Council was an ex officio member of the Guild Council. Became President of the Guild in 1964. The Guild ran the Guild facilities. 54:44 Being Guild President was a very responsible job. In 1964, commenced Articles, was finishing Arts degree (history and politics), was Guild President. Lived back at home in 1964. While Guild President asked by Vice Chancellor not to mention charges against German lecturer during PROSH. 59:13 Ethics taught as part of Barrister’s Board course. Law Reform Commission established in 1975. Law reform took place through the political process. Not many law reform movements in the early 1960s. It was a stable time. After the Vietnam War things changed. Law students were expected to be dressed neatly and they wore gowns to lectures. 1:02:14 Graduated in 1964. Did Articles for Downing and Downing. Found work experience taught him a lot especially in drafting documents. Supervised by Frank Downing QC. Separate Bar established in 1963 – only 3-4 members. No computers. Very old fashioned photo copier. Recommended to Downing & Downing by a previous Guild President. Applied and was accepted. Interview 2 Track 1 00:00 Introduction by Julia Wallis 00:30 Graduated in April 1964. Applied for Rhodes Scholarship. Candidates had to attend a dinner at Government House and a selection committee chaired by the Governor (at that time Major-General Kendrew ). Left for Oxford in August 1965 for the start of term in September. Did a post-graduate Bachelor of Civil Law degree. Did a preliminary examination after two terms. The course started in the second year. Tutored by Peter Carter. Also some lectures and seminars taken by Professor Rupert Cross and Professor Herbert Hart. The examination involved 3 compulsory subjects and 3 optional subjects. 5 out of the 19 students in the year failed. Different teaching method to UWA - read essays to the tutor and the teaching was generally one on one. The course was an intense study of limited subjects. 06:57 Lived in at Wadham College in the first year. Not as formal as St George’s. Dined in hall – ate gammon steak every week. Second year lived in a flat in town which broadened his horizons. Used college and Bodleian law library. Played some hockey in invitation matches against places such as Rugby School. Didn’t do any rowing but viewed a couple of races and did have a try at punting. Future wife, Judith, came to Oxford to work as a research associate at the Institute of Experimental Psychology in his second year. Only two examinations – the preliminary exam and the final exam at the end of the 3rd term of the second year. There were also oral examinations. 13:30 Left Oxford in about July 1967. Got straight back into doing Articles. Accepted back to Downing & Downing. Had done 18-19 months out of 24 months of required Articles. Was 5 days short of the required time so could not be called to the Bar by the Full Court in the December 1967 sittings. The next sittings were in February 1968. Admitted in Feb 1968. Married Judith in December 1967. Invited to become a junior partner in Downing & Downing on admission. Did court work, conveying, commercial and advisory work. Now there is more specialisation. The degree from Oxford taught him about legal method and analysis. 17:34 During his third year as a partner he was recruited by David Malcolm to take up a position as Counsel for the Asian Development Bank in Manila. Downing & Downing very disappointed. Left in April 1971 and started work on 1 May. Lived in ex pat villages – secured by guards. Judith was not able to work in Manila. About 35 nationalities worked at the ADB. Japan and the US were the biggest contributors. The bank loaned money to developing countries for major infrastructure projects or to create projects. Moved from being a lawyer to an operations officer for the 3rd and 4th years at the Bank 24:55 Left after 4 years but kept in touch with friends they had made in Canada, Switzerland, Finland, the US and Malaysia. Manila was full of people and vehicles. Guards and fire arms was the norm. Travelled on missions every 3-4 weeks for the bank and saw a lot of Asia. 30:09 Decided not to return to Downing & Downing and go up to the Bar [1975]. Took about 18 months to be established. The independent Bar was initially at 525 Hay Street. Later it moved to Law Chambers – this building no longer exists. In November 1992, the Bar moved to Allendale Square. Did not specialise but tended to concentrate on commercial law - contract, town planning and taxation. Had no interest in criminal, family or industrial law. 34:09 Asked to be an examiner in practice & procedure for UWA Law School. Tutored in Trusts and developed a set of tutorial subjects. Lectured in part of the taxation course – stamp duty, Commonwealth Estate Duty, Commonwealth Gift Duty and Estate Probate Duty. All these duties apart from stamp duty were abolished in the late 70s. The staff and the course structure was had changed since the early 60s. 36:43 January 1982, appointed Queen’s Counsel after 7 years at the Bar (aged 39). Queen’s Counsel appointed by the Chief Justice. Expected to be independent and learned enough in the law to take on difficult cases some needing more than one Counsel. Malcolm McCusker appointed on the same day. Difficult cases included representing West Coast Telecasters in a hearing before the Australian Broadcasting Tribunal (1984) to get a third television licence in WA. Another was the Wittenoom Asbestos test case in 1988 which went for 13 months - Heys & Barrow v CSR Limited. 40:54 President of the Law Society of Western Australia in 1984. Elected to the Law Society in about 1980, chaired various committees and was Vice President in about 1983. The President is expected to be spokesperson on every legal issue. They negotiated the purchase of a floor of a building at 68 St Georges Terrace. The premises had been in the old Supreme Court building (now the Sir Francis Burt Law Education Centre and Museum). They subsequently moved several times. The Law Society contributes submissions on legal subjects to government and was a constituent member of the Law Council of Australia and participated in doing the same thing at a Commonwealth level. It ran an education programme for lawyers and social events for members. In the mid-80s, a rift developed between the full-time staff at the Faculty of Law at UWA and the Part-time teachers who were legal practitioners. The part-time staff thought the teaching should focus more on the practice of law rather than the philosophy of a particular subject. 49:49 Was President of the Law Council from 1986-1987 and had previously represented the Law Society on these meetings of Law Societies and Bar Associations of the various States and Territories. Persuaded the executive to meet in Perth on one occasion. From then on, they decided that members must travel to interstate meetings by business class! Unlike the case in Qld, NSW and Vic, solicitors practising in Tas, SA, WA and the NT could represent their client at court. Three of the Bar Associations gave notice that they intended to leave the Law Council. Negotiated to keep them in. Changed Constitution to ensure that a barrister from one of the Bar Associations was always on the Law Council. Interview 3 00:00 Introduction by Julia Wallis 00:46 Invited to become Director of the Telethon Institute for Child Health Research in 1987. He had been an early board member and was involved in setting up the organisation which at that time was called the Western Australian Institute for Child Health. It is now called ‘Telethon Kids Institute’. Professor Fiona Stanley was the inaugural director. It started off very small and has grown considerably. Extensive research is carried out into childhood diseases. Drafted the Constitution for the Friends of the Institute. Remained as a director when he was elected to Parliament but resigned in March 1996 when he was appointed Attorney-General. 05:46 In the 1970s was active in the Liberal Party and stood for pre-selection for a State seat but was unsuccessful. Later stood in an unwinnable seat and managed to increase the percentage of the vote for the Liberal Party. Did not feel it was appropriate to be active in a political party while being involved in legal politics. Later approached by Peter Shack who was going to retire from the seat of Tangney. D Williams agreed to stand and won the seat. John Hewson, then leader of the Opposition, appointed him as Shadow Attorney-General and Shadow Minister Assisting the Leader in Constitutional Reform before he had even sat in Parliament. When Alexander Downer replaced John Hewson he did not confirm his appointment. John Howard replaced Alexander Downer in 1995 and won office on 11 March 1996. John Howard appointed D Williams as Attorney General and Minister for Justice in the First Howard Ministry. Made a member of Cabinet in October 1997 retaining the position of Attorney General but losing the position of Minister for Justice. Remained in Cabinet until July 2004. For his last 10 months in Cabinet he ceased to be Attorney-General and became Minister for Communications, Information Technology and the Arts. 10:47 Alexander Downer had appointed Amanda Vanstone as Shadow Attorney General but she became Minister for Employment, Education, Training and Youth Affairs under John Howard. The legal profession regard the Attorney-General as being their minister and the courts regard the Attorney-General as being their promoter and protector. Mr Williams does not think the Attorney-General, being a politician, should speak for the judiciary as he is not independent of Government. The Attorney-General has a wide portfolio – he recommends Court appointments to Cabinet. The Federal Magistrate’s Court or Circuit Court was established in this time. The Administrative Appeals Tribunal also falls under this portfolio. The Attorney General is responsible for censorship and co-ordinates the states to ensure there is a uniform system. The Attorney-General is also responsible for the Australian Government Solicitor. In his time it was agreed that government departments could brief private firms to ensure competition. 16:59 National security became a very significant matter and the department grew in response to threats such as 9/11 (September 11 and the Bali Bombings (2002). Some major legislation was drafted. There is a National Security Committee of Cabinet but the opposition is regularly briefed on matters. 21:21 D Williams sought to reform the Human Rights and Equal Opportunity Commission by changing its name and seeking to make Commissioners responsible across the board instead of just in their particular areas. This was not supported in the community. He sees the forming of the Federal Magistrate’s Court as being an important initiative. 23:57 The Attorney-General’s Department has a large staff and he found the quality of his staff to be excellent. The department was located in Barton and Comm cars were used to get to and from Parliament. At first, he stayed with family but it soon became necessary to rent a flat in Kingston. He would leave Canberra for Perth on Thursday or Friday. 29:32 Returning to Perth on the weekend, he would visit his parents and try to play hockey or tennis but had to leave for Canberra again on Sunday. He was the only person in Cabinet from WA although other Ministers came from WA. There was very little lobbying of him by the WA State Liberal Party. The travel to and from Canberra could be arduous. There was very little time to read Cabinet papers in time for the meeting on Monday so John Howard changed the meeting to Tuesday. Members were entitled to have their spouse visit up to about 9 times during the year. Parliament sits late into the evening especially on Monday and Tuesday. Qantas introduced a direct Canberra-Perth flight on Thursday night. 38:34 Members stayed in touch with their respective States and the country as a whole via a news clip service that put together portfolio collections. He visited his electorate office on a Friday or Saturday to sign mail and keep in touch with the staff. He thinks the government system works well as long as there are people with good will. He feels minor party representation make government difficult. 41:27 In about 1996/97 the Republican movement was active. Cabinet decided to hold a Constitutional Convention to discuss the idea of Australia becoming a republic. Unfortunately the Republican side could not agree on a method of electing a President. 44:00 The Attorney-General has to approve positions to be taken in important litigation which enabled him to keep abreast of what was happening in the law. There was also an intensive legislative programme. However, there was no time to read law reports and study law which made it quite challenging. When he returned to work as a QC in 2003, the way that law was practised had changed significantly in 11 years. There was much more focus on technology. There were also a lot more lawyers practising in WA. The type of legal work has widened – i.e. environmental law and planning law. 47:35 He met fellow UWA law graduates when he was practising. There was a 50th reunion of the graduates of 1964 on 31 May 2004. He maintains closer contacts with the people he was at St George’s college with. He hopes to continue to practice law for several more years. Audio Files Links to audio files <a href="http://oralhistories.arts.uwa.edu.au/files/original/1450645e6128ea23aed042f9928953af.mp3">Williams, Interview 1, Track 1</a> <br /><a href="http://oralhistories.arts.uwa.edu.au/files/original/b7326dead7b3a8a4b310c231a055a3ce.mp3">Williams, Interview 2, Track 1</a> <br /><a href="http://oralhistories.arts.uwa.edu.au/files/original/250b78b0681f7f34fbaf340d459b452f.mp3">Williams, Interview 3, Track 1</a> Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Daryl Williams interview, 20 August 2014, 26 August 2014 and 1 September 2014 Subject The topic of the resource Law Description An account of the resource Williams was born in East Fremantle, Western Australia, and was educated at the University of Western Australia and Wadham College, Oxford, where he was a Rhodes Scholar in 1965. In 1968, Williams started work as a barrister. In 1971, he became counsel for the Asian Development Bank. However, four years later, he returned to practising law on his own. He was appointed Queen's Counsel in 1982, and became a Member of the Order of Australia in 1989. Williams continued to practise law until his election to Parliament in 1993. Williams was briefly a member of the Opposition Shadow Ministry in 1994, serving as Shadow Attorney-General and Shadow Minister Assisting the Leader of the Opposition on Constitutional Reform. In 1996, when the Liberals won office, he was appointed to the Cabinet as Attorney-General. He served in this capacity until 2003. Williams was also Minister for Justice for a period in 1996–97. He had also attended the 1998 Constitutional Convention as a parliamentary delegate. After the Liberal ministerial shakeup of 2003, Williams was appointed Minister for Communications, Information Technology and the Arts. In April 2004, he announced he would not be contesting the 2004 election. He stood down from the ministry in July 2004. Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Williams, Daryl Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available University of Western Australia Historical Society Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource Copyright holder University of Western Australia Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource MP3 files Type The nature or genre of the resource Oral History Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource UWA ORAL HISTORIES Description An account of the resource A collection of interviews with former UWA staff, recorded by the <a href="http://www.alumni.uwa.edu.au/community/historical-society" target="_blank">UWA Historical Society</a> to mark the Centenary of the University in 2013. <br />The UWA Historical Society’s <a href="http://www.alumni.uwa.edu.au/community/historical-society/oral-histories" target="_blank">Oral History Program</a> started as a project with four oral histories funded from Society resources. It was then expanded with support from every Faculty on campus, the Guild, Convocation and through private donations. Additional funding was received through a Heritage Grant. Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available University of Western Australia Historical Society Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource University of Western Australia Historical Society Oral History A resource containing historical information obtained in interviews with persons having firsthand knowledge. Interviewer The person(s) performing the interview Anne Yardley Interviewee The person(s) being interviewed Harold Clough Location The location of the interview Nedlands, W.A. Duration Length of time involved (seconds, minutes, hours, days, class periods, etc.) Interview 1: 1 hour, 15 minutes, 08 seconds Interview 2: 49 minutes, 58 seconds Total: 2 hours, 5 minutes, 06 seconds Bit Rate/Frequency Rate at which bits are transferred (i.e. 96 kbit/s would be FM quality audio) 128 kbs Time Summary A summary of an interview given for different time stamps throughout the interview Interview 1 00:00 Introduction by Anne Yardley. 00:55 William Harold Clough, born 30 September 1926, Subiaco. Father John Oswald Clough, born Richmond Victoria, 1887; mother Lucy Hayes born Landsborough Victoria. Father was in the Gallipoli landing, later fought in France and received a commission. 02:47 After the First World War he joined brother William Clough to form Clough Brothers builders. Building work stopped during the Depression, William went gold mining in Southern Cross as there was still a market for gold. The Goldfields flourished during Depression. Father was out of work and joined militia. Times were tough. It was an awful experience having a father out of work. There was no dole and unemployment was 30 or 40 per cent. 06:00 Harold attended Nedlands Primary School from age 6 to 12; Claremont Central School, 12 to 15 years during the Second World War. His father was now a Lieutenant Colonel commanding the 2nd Field Third Regiment. Harold became a troop leader in the boy scouts where he had many interesting experiences. He relates a story about an assignment to go to Mundaring and carry out tasks set out in a sealed envelope. The boys camped overnight in wet winter conditions. He learnt a lot in scouting. 13:45 After school his ambition was to go into the army. The war was going badly for the Allies but that changed in 1942 with United States involvement. He believes the Japanese could have won had they not bombed Pearl Harbour when they did. 18:00 Harold completed Leaving [now TEE] at Scotch College at age 16. The two year course had been truncated into one year during the war. Harold passed and applied to Duntroon but was told he was too young. With the experience of the Depression his mother recommended he work in a bank or insurance company. He took a job at AMP [Australian Mutual Provident Society] “by far the worst year of my life, never been so bored ...” His job was to send overdue premiums to clients using hand written envelopes. He admits he wasn’t very good at it. Few men were available to do office work during the war. 23:30 He met a girl there who persuaded him to try for university. He applied for engineering at UWA with only 40 places available, 100 students studying engineering out of 1000 students in the entire university. Harold was offered a place by the Dean, Professor Howard Blakey, who told him he’d never got through as he was number 40 on the list. Harold determined to prove him wrong and worked hard during the first semester. To pass engineering, students had to be either good students or good rugby players, according to Harold. 26:50 Harold took up rugby and won a half blue. He was more proud of that than getting his degree. During the war, the engineering course was reduced to three years instead of five and called a Bachelor of Science and Engineering. After the war the degree course was increased to four years. Harold was given first class honours which allowed him to win a Fulbright Scholarship. “University changed my life and ever after I’ve been particularly grateful for that.” He was very active in student affairs: on the guild council and played sport. His girlfriend, who was studying psychology, introduced Harold to the Arts. 32:00 After graduation Harold worked for Cooperative Bulk Handling, a subsidiary of Wesfarmers—a good job and good experience. The Fulbright scholarship was only in its second year when he took up the scholarship in 1951 to study for a Masters degree. 35:50 Prior to that Harold and a friend had driven to Sydney picking up jobs along the way. He worked as a miner underground in Kalgoorlie and recounts that experience. He worked in Sydney as a time and motion expert. There he learnt he had won the scholarship. He returned to Perth as his mother had died, before travelling to California by plane—an unusual event in those days—to be met by his uncle who lived in Los Angeles. 42:50 In San Francisco he stayed at International House attached to the University of California where he was registered as William Harold Clough and so he became Bill to everyone in America including his wife. He lived in the International House with other overseas students. He describes their living arrangements including the common dining room where he met students from many different countries including Iran. 46:00 Harold wanted to study economics but the course didn’t yet exist anywhere in the world. The closest was to become an accountant by apprenticeship. Harold enrolled in industrial engineering which didn’t prepare him for being in business for himself. He gained a reputation for giving great parties. He neglected his studies until he discovered he would have to pay for his course if he didn’t gain a 3.5 grade average. With last minute studying, he gained better marks than he had in Australia. He believed the Australian education system was superior to that of the US. 50:04 Australian graduates had better fundamentals, better basics. Harold won a Harold Holt scholarship for five years study to gain a PhD [doctoral degree] but not wanting to be an academic, he turned it down. Instead he took a job with Bechtel Corporation, one of the biggest engineering contractors in the US at the time. He was keen to be in the field but his job was desk bound in the estimating department for the experience. He was told: “The single most important thing in the construction business is to know the costs…you have to be able to measure the quantity of work that’s done for that amount of money.” The experience was vital to learn about accurate costing. Good companies do this well, including Clough Engineering. The present manager at Clough “has taken it to a new level.” 54:24 Harold returned to Australia with his wife [Australian Margaret, née McRae, whose father worked in the Australian Consul General’s office in San Francisco]. His father encouraged Harold to return to work in the family business where he was put him to work as a builder’s labourer on a site in Newcastle Street. He learnt a lot. 57:00 End of the first year the accounts showed they hadn’t made any money despite having plenty of work. His father was very good with figures and was working a scam involving invoicing. Harold was angry, he now had a wife and child to support. They considered returning to the US but the business won a large contract to build a new head office for National Mutual Life Association. At six storeys it would be the biggest building in Perth. The architect, Athol Hobbs, had served with Harold’s father in the war and helped with their bid, despite their different social status. Father and son worked hard on the tender but disagreed on the final price. Harold asked his wife for advice about adding 5,000 pounds to the tender instead of the 10,000 pounds his father wanted. Harold took his wife’s advice and they won the bid. 1:10:50 A condition of being awarded the contract was that Harold would be the manager. He took charge of the cheque book. Harold admits they lacked the experience to tackle a 500,000 pound job, their previous job was 20 or 30,000 pounds. The lowest bid is not always accepted, the architect’s recommendation is important as well. They were successful in the project, helped by employing very good people. Some of those people were still with Clough when Harold retired. 1:15:28 END first interview Interview 2 00:00 Introduction by Anne Yardley 00:40 Post Second World War the government decided the Causeway bridge was becoming overloaded and needed another bridge . The Narrows site was chosen and Main Roads consulted bridge designers in London: Maunsell and Partners were selected and recommended a pre-cast, post tension concrete bridge. Pre-stressed concreted was newly developed. Harold saw this as an opportunity to work with an international contractor and using his Bechtel experience, he applied for and signed a joint venture agreement with Christiani and Nielsen a Danish company who were awarded the contract. 03:50 Clough held 20 percent, their role to provide local information about conditions, regulations. The team became integrated with half Danish, half Australian engineers. The project went relatively smoothly, delays caused by conditions being different from those assumed by the designers: about half way through construction a problem emerged with the northern end of the bridge on reclaimed land with soil extruded sideways as well as down which pushed the piles sideways. Construction was held up while a solution found. 08:00 Harold remained concerned that the top corner of the Y shape column on the downstream side could fail. He still checks it out when driving across the bridge. Harold believes it has performed very well, required little maintenance. 09:30 The bridge was particularly important for Perth as it was the first time a large engineering structure had been built by non-government entity. It set a trend, the government began using more private companies. Now State and Federal public works departments have very small team, most work is done by private companies. 10:30 The bridge contract made a big difference to Clough, previously builders, they now became engineering contractors. The iron ore industry was starting up in WA and for the first time there were large projects requiring major engineering input: railways, power stations. Clough moved more towards engineering and construction, including oil and gas projects, but maintained a building arm at about 10 to 15 per cent of total work volume. 12:30 This was personally a busy time for Harold as he and wife Margaret raised their six children, the first four born in quick succession over five years. In 1970 the family took an extended European holiday. Harold got to know his children better in these six weeks than in previous years. 15:10 His eldest son, Jock, studied engineering and although he didn’t enjoy engineering, he did join the family business. In 2005 a mutual decision was made to sell the business to Murray & Roberts over a three year period , the only remaining connection is with the name Clough. Had Jock maintained an interest in engineering, Clough could have remained a company business although Harold believes it is difficult for family dynasties to be successful. Harold’s only regret in selling the business was the loss of his name. 18:00 The Narrows Bridge project changed Clough but also changed the industry [in WA]. Clough did “some great projects” over the years. By 2005 Clough was working more overseas than in Australia with a great team of engineers. 19:00 In 1998 the decision was made to float the company. By then there were 21 offices worldwide and an annual turnover of 600 million dollars. Harold always had in mind the idea to list although decision making is easier in a non-listed company. When spending other people’s money there are more complicated decisions to make, morally and legally. It’s much easier to expand, to raise money as a public company. Particularly in the construction business, the biggest companies are family companies. Bechtel advised Harold against listing—Harold wonders if he was right. 21:50 The decision was partly governed by changes to taxation legislation. Prior to this bonuses given to staff were considered income and fully taxed but when able to get a credit for tax paid on dividends, being a public company was more attractive. By that time, staff owned 20 per cent of the business through a practice of allocating shares. Harold believes it was the right decision at the right time. 23:45 They had about 80% of the company when it listed and were allocated shares. Harold handed out shares to staff “like Father Christmas—it was great. The company was doing particularly well at the time.” 24:30 Harold comments on his business success: “by far the biggest factor was being able to have people in your team that were as good or better than you were. The strength of a company is the quality of its people. It’s all about people.” Attracting and keeping good people is more about giving people challenges and responsibilities than money; ensuring staff get satisfaction from the work. “Giving them a job they enjoyed doing is much more important than giving them more money.” 26:15 On the decision to sell the company: Jock was Chairman of Clough, Harold was “just” a board member. They had an “unfortunate” contract with Origen, oil company, which resulted in litigation, despite Clough’s doing a good job: “it was soul destroying.” Harold felt he no longer wanted to be in the business. 28:10 Harold felt retirement would shorten his life, he decided to keep busy with the family company, McCrae Investments. He enjoys the diversity of the business. 29:10 On donating to charity: It’s important. Harold says most companies have a charity budget with demands on them 20 times over and they’re all good causes. Harold’s focus has been on UWA. 31:20 Harold lectured briefly at UWA after his return from the United States. Like many he had an aversion to talking in public but an engaged group of students, willing to debate, helped him overcome his public speaking discomfort. 33:15 Harold was conscious that the quality of the company was very dependent on the quality of its staff, he felt that by offering scholarships to engineering students in their last year and then offering a job on completion, the company would attract “the cream of the cream”. Over the years, Clough has offered 149 scholarships, most have remained in touch and are in leading companies worldwide. Scholarships offered money, vocational employment, a mentor in the company and a job when they finished. About 50 per cent stayed employed with them. 36:20 “Looking back on it, I think the scholarship scheme was one of the best things I did in the company.” In choosing recipients, the company was looking for academic success and leadership qualities. Harold discusses Clough Circle dinners and his eldest daughter Sue’s involvement with Scott Neeson program’s in Cambodia [Cambodia Children’s Fund] that selects children from waste dumps, houses and educates them. A potential donor to the fund who had been a Clough scholarship recipient instituted the Circle. Harold feels “very good” that Clough scholars are inspired by the Clough example to contribute to the community. 43:55 On winning awards: Harold has been received numerous awards including: Queen’s Silver Jubilee medal 1977; OBE 1979; Officer of the Order of Australia (AO) 1990; Honorary Doctor of Engineering in 1990 and others. He feels very proud to have been recognised: “It’s something that happens rather than something you work for.” Harold’s a monarchist and recalls the time of titles being awarded. 46:10 Harold credits his work colleagues and clients with giving him the greatest satisfaction in his working life. Projects can be both good and bad. He likes challenges: “If it was too easy, it wouldn’t be nearly as enjoyable.” The harder you work the more luck you have. 49:55 On retirement: “I want to die in the chair”. Work keeps him going. McCrae Investments are very busy. 49:58 ENDS Audio Files Links to audio files <a href="http://oralhistories.arts.uwa.edu.au/files/original/8ab18f242a63472cf87f2156b7b3974e.mp3">Clough, Interview 1, Track 1</a> <br /><a href="http://oralhistories.arts.uwa.edu.au/files/original/4bb8621fa321cdad59220271f8f5f72f.mp3">Clough, Interview 1, Track 2</a> <br /><a href="http://oralhistories.arts.uwa.edu.au/files/original/608bea0ec516183e0df3ee080ea0b56e.mp3">Clough, Interview 2, Track 1</a> Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Harold Clough interview, 17 June 2014 and 20 June 2014 Subject The topic of the resource Engineering Description An account of the resource Harold Clough AO, OBE, CitWA is a graduate of UWA who went on to become an engineering pioneer and leading businessman. He joined the Clough family company in 1954, serving as Managing Director until 1988, and Chairman of Clough Limited until late 2002. He is the recipient of numerous awards including the Queen's Silver Jubilee Medal, awarded in 1977, Office of the Order of the British Empire in 1979, Officer of the Order of Australia in 1990. He was WA Citizen of the Year in Industry and Commerce in 1983 and won the Australasian Institution of Electrical Engineers James N Kirby Award and the Institution of Engineers Australia, Peter Nicol Russell Memorial Medal in 1993 and the Australian Institute of Company Directors (WA) inaugural gold medal for contributions to engineering, industry and commerce in 1994. Mr Clough received an Honorary Degree of Doctor of Engineering from the University of Western Australia in 1990. Speaking at a UWA graduation ceremony, he was quoted as saying: “Be enterprising, work hard, take a risk. The disappointments and disasters are shattering, but the harder you work the luckier you get. So I think the two things are associated.” Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Clough, Harold Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available University of Western Australia Historical Society Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource Copyright holder University of Western Australia Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource MP3 files Type The nature or genre of the resource Oral History Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource UWA ORAL HISTORIES Description An account of the resource A collection of interviews with former UWA staff, recorded by the <a href="http://www.alumni.uwa.edu.au/community/historical-society" target="_blank">UWA Historical Society</a> to mark the Centenary of the University in 2013. <br />The UWA Historical Society’s <a href="http://www.alumni.uwa.edu.au/community/historical-society/oral-histories" target="_blank">Oral History Program</a> started as a project with four oral histories funded from Society resources. It was then expanded with support from every Faculty on campus, the Guild, Convocation and through private donations. Additional funding was received through a Heritage Grant. Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available University of Western Australia Historical Society Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource University of Western Australia Historical Society Oral History A resource containing historical information obtained in interviews with persons having firsthand knowledge. Interviewer The person(s) performing the interview Julia Wallis Interviewee The person(s) being interviewed Basil Balme Location The location of the interview Claremont, W.A. Duration Length of time involved (seconds, minutes, hours, days, class periods, etc.) 58 minutes, 56 seconds Bit Rate/Frequency Rate at which bits are transferred (i.e. 96 kbit/s would be FM quality audio) 128 kbs Time Summary A summary of an interview given for different time stamps throughout the interview Track 1 00:00 Introduction by Julia Wallis 01:47 Track 2 00:00 Grandfather from Bradford, Yorkshire, UK. Basil’s father worked at Collie and farmed at Meckering. Later, he bought a shop in Victoria Park and then at Mends Street, South Perth. Basil’s mother taught piano. Basil’s father was gassed during the Battle of Passchendaele in about 1917. He was a heavy smoker and died in his early forties (c 1935). Basil attended schools in Victoria Park, Como and Subiaco. Subsequently, he attended Perth Boy’s School. He did the Junior Certificate and passed 10 subjects and won a scholarship which gave him entry into Scotch College. Luckily he was good at sports and played in their football and cricket teams. They beat Aquinas College to win the Darlow Cup at the WACA in 1939. He became Head Boy at Scotch College but thinks it was because so many boys left due to WWII. 06:45 Basil wanted to do law but you had to have Leaving Latin. He did first year engineering at UWA but realised that it wasn’t for him. There was no medical school at this time. He didn’t want to get called up into the army so he joined the Royal Australian Navy in 1942 and became a radar officer. He was on the corvette HMAS Cowra doing convoy duty in the Pacific for about 2 years and then did more training before serving on the Bungaree. 11:15 After the war he went back to UWA and studied geology. Returned servicemen had their fees paid. He had a scholarship to St George’s College. At this time, Basil considered UWA to be a training school for professionals rather than a university. There was very little research being done apart from perhaps in the Department of Agriculture. The first Professor of Zoology who came to UWA in 1948, Harry Waring (1910-1980) , changed the attitude of UWA towards research. 15:30 Teaching in Geology was very good. Professor Rex Prider was a mineralogist. R W Fairbridge published a lot of work. Curt Teichert was a palaeontologist. He was not there when Basil did his Honours year. The system in those days was to do a three year degree course followed by a year of research. You were expected to find your own project. Basil was approached by Joe Lord, the Surveyor-General, to look at a new technique called palynology. It was the study of the fossil pollen and spore of fossil plants that had been distributed by the wind and incorporated in marine and non-marine sediments. They were very resistant to decay. This had originally developed for the coal industry in England but it was highly successful and could be employed in the oil industry as well. Basil established his reputation and made a lot of money for the Department. This method is used widely today in the Departments of Archaeology and Anthropology. Field trips to the Irwin River every year until Honours year to see fossils in strata. You could also do field work in your Honours year. 20:44 The spores and pollen study made it quite easy to get jobs. At one time Basil got a Fullbright Scholarship to Harvard and was paid on the staff for another year before getting a job at New York University for about 3 years. He also had a paid television programme in New York. Harvard had lots of Nobel prize winners and is one of the most prestigious universities in the world. Basil was in the USA in 1963 when President John F Kennedy was shot in Dallas by Lee Harvey Oswald. The contrast between Harvard and UWA at that time was huge. UWA is very different now and has a large research focus and an emphasis on seeking knowledge. 24:11 When Basil was a student at UWA, he played sport and drank beer. They had social functions such as a Friday social where he met young women. St George’s College was very comfortable. The Warden was Josh Reynolds. Basil was on its Council for a couple of years. There were formal dinners in the evening. The Warden would say a formal grace before dinner. Lectures started at 9am. Students wore gowns to the evening meals but not to lectures like the Law students. 27:19 There was a library in the Geology Department so Basil did not use the university library that much. St George’s College library was quite widely used. The Zoologists had their own library and so did Mathematics and Physics. The department was training the students to go and work in the gold industry. By the time Basil reached Honours level, the oil industry had just been established in WA and attitudes changed. Geology in America was very much about exploring for oil 32:25 Basil worked for the National Coal Board in Sheffield, England from about 1949 to 1952 after he left St George’s College. He got married in England. They looked at the composition of the coals. Australian coals are different and contain more water. After the Coal Board, Basil worked for the CSIRO in Sydney studying oil exploration for about 3 years. 37:39 He returned to Perth in about 1957 to teach in the Geology Department at UWA. He believes that he was approached by the university. Basil recalls that Professor Eric Underwood in the Agriculture Department had a substantial research reputation. Harry Waring added to this emphasis when he arrived at UWA in 1948. Basil was asked to teach basic geology to classes of agriculture and engineering students. One of his students gained a considerable reputation in the field of spores and pollen research. Rex Prider didn’t do a great deal of supervision as not many students were that interested in mineralogy. He didn’t feel it was a very exciting department. The syllabus had not developed very much but Basil developed his own subjects based on his research interests. Professor Clark was the original professor before Prider. Basil’s teaching methods were different and he spent time with individual students in their Honours years. 42:39 Basil took field trips but not for Honours students. The Department did not approve of this. They felt that field work was an essential aspect of Geology. Field Geology and field mapping has gone out of fashion now and has been supplemented by Geophysics and surveys. There are not many exposures of rocks around Perth so the nearest field trips would be Collie or Irwin River. Staff would stake the students in their own cars or they would hire buses. They had to bring their own food and tents. 46:50 When Basil returned to UWA in 1946 there were staff shortages. Most of the younger men had gone away to WWII leaving behind the “God” professors. When he went back to teach in the late 1950s the teaching method had not changed dramatically. Job opportunities for geologists were few and included working for the survey, CSIRO or university teaching. Returning from America he still found that there was still little emphasis on research. 51:28 The Festival of Perth would have been operating from UWA campus. UWA was always very active in drama. Basil appeared in several of their plays. He was on the Senate and was Chairman of the Scholarships Committee. 54:50 Basil could have ended up as a farmer but UWA introduced him to areas of great interest and provided him with job opportunities and income. 56:09 Audio Files Links to audio files <a href="http://oralhistories.arts.uwa.edu.au/files/original/b328e9fbd63c58d610649708bafa8bde.mp3">Balme, Interview 1, Track 1</a> <br /><a href="http://oralhistories.arts.uwa.edu.au/files/original/228e3d21c6ee710494e5b8a866e6a4dc.mp3">Balme, Interview 1, Track 2</a> Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Basil Balme interview, 15 October 2014 Subject The topic of the resource Geology Description An account of the resource Basil Balme was an undergraduate at UWA at the beginning of the 1940s, but like many he enlisted for military service around 1942 after second year and served in the Australian Navy, returning to finish his degree in 1946 and graduating in 1948. In 1947 he was awarded the Edward Sydney Simpson Prize as well as the Lady James Prize in Natural Science (both jointly with John Glover). He returned to teach at UWA around 1957, eventually becoming Acting Head of Department (for Professor Harris), and Head of Department in 1984, before his own retirement. Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Balme, Basil Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available University of Western Australia Historical Society Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource Copyright holder University of Western Australia Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource MP3 files Type The nature or genre of the resource Oral History Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource UWA ORAL HISTORIES Description An account of the resource A collection of interviews with former UWA staff, recorded by the <a href="http://www.alumni.uwa.edu.au/community/historical-society" target="_blank">UWA Historical Society</a> to mark the Centenary of the University in 2013. <br />The UWA Historical Society’s <a href="http://www.alumni.uwa.edu.au/community/historical-society/oral-histories" target="_blank">Oral History Program</a> started as a project with four oral histories funded from Society resources. It was then expanded with support from every Faculty on campus, the Guild, Convocation and through private donations. Additional funding was received through a Heritage Grant. Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available University of Western Australia Historical Society Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource University of Western Australia Historical Society Oral History A resource containing historical information obtained in interviews with persons having firsthand knowledge. Interviewer The person(s) performing the interview Julia Wallis Interviewee The person(s) being interviewed Colin Campbell-Fraser Location The location of the interview Gwelup, W.A. Duration Length of time involved (seconds, minutes, hours, days, class periods, etc.) Interview 1: 1 hour 4 minutes, 50 seconds Interview 2: 1 hour, 14 minutes, 50 seconds Interview 3: 1 hour, 49 minutes, 34 seconds Total: 4 hours, 9 minutes, 14 seconds Bit Rate/Frequency Rate at which bits are transferred (i.e. 96 kbit/s would be FM quality audio) 128 kbs Time Summary A summary of an interview given for different time stamps throughout the interview Interview 1 Track 1 00:00 Introduction by Julia Wallis 01:15 Track 2 00:00 Colin Stewart Campbell-Fraser born 29 October 1945 in Corrigin. Family lived at Bruce Rock until he was about 10 years old. Father PNG technical transferred to Perth and the family lived at Hobart Street, North Perth. Got Junior Certificate at Tuart Hill High School. Became a copy boy at WA Newspapers with a view to becoming an apprentice compositor. Father impressed on him the value of getting an apprenticeship. When he turned 18, he was called up to the Vietnam War but it was deferred until he finished his apprenticeship. He joined the army in 1967. WA Newspapers (WAN) was located at 162 St George’s Terrace. His job was to put the pages of the newspaper together in metal frames. The industry went through many technical changes and Cam was involved in these as a union member and shop steward and later production supervisor. The company had made up the difference between his normal pay and what the army paid him which was very generous and engendered his loyalty. Returned to WAN in 1969. 04:26 Coming back to WAN was like returning home. People didn’t move around so much in those days. Cam attended a Trades & Labour Council Conference at the age of 16. Five of the speakers told the young men in the audience that the days of a job for life were over. In time he became a floor hand then held supervisory positions in charge of shifts. There were four shifts between the Daily News and the West Australian. Staff rotated through the shifts every 3 months. When he was working as a copy boy in 1961 on the Pictorial Desk he was encouraged to do study with a view to taking a photography cadetship. He studied at Tuart Hill High School to do Leaving English but did not complete it. As a result of army service he was paid to do 1 year full time study or 2 years part-time. He went back to Leederville Tech to do his leaving and did one year of English and one year of English Literature. The following year he went to re-enrol and was advised to do a mature-aged Matriculation which could take him to university. He repeated English and did Economics which gave him entry into UWA in 1972. 10:54 He enrolled in English Literature and Politics. Bob Hetherington lectured in Politics. 1972 was the year that Labor swept into power under Gough Whitlam. He had always read at home so it wasn’t a chore to study literature. He was enthused and stimulated by the study. He was initially quite intimated by the younger students but soon realised he had life experience on his side. The lecturers and the administration staff were supportive. The hardest part was trying to balance work, study and family life. You had to enrol for a full year at UWA whereas WAIT or Curtin had a semester system. He often had to withdraw from units. 15:34 The lecturers and tutorials were generally from about 4pm. He had to learn how to use the library for research. There were other matured aged people studying particularly after 1972. They weren’t so many team projects in those days. Several mature-aged people were studying industrial relations. This led to a more collegial atmosphere. 20:40 He loved Ancient History and enjoyed studying the politics of the period and the fact that life has not changed so much in the way we organise ourselves. Industrial relations and the psychology of managing the work force were beginning to be popular. Cam learned that he was an informal leader. The impact of his studies made the newspaper realise that he had potential. Cam recalled some excellent debates with the sub editors and journalists. 25:06 Although UWA staff sympathised with his plight, the university had not formal support for part-time and/or mature aged students. He needed and welcomed the feedback that he got from the academic staff. He felt empowered as an individual whereas on the shop floor he was merely a production unit. Discussion and debate was also quite strong within the union movement. The union was a very good training ground for learning how to manage issues. The printing industry was faced with vast changes in technology. People had to transition and learn new skills. More women coming into the work force was a challenge for many! They were prepared for the technological changes as print media in other areas of the world had already gone through this. Cam was taught how to type in the army as signals officer. He found this a very useful skill when keyboarding and computers were introduced. 31:32 In 1978, the Herald newspaper in Melbourne took over WAN. People who left were not replaced and they moved from employment of journalist cadetships to graduate journalists. Many of these graduates left rather than do the mundane jobs. Cam was approached by the Editor of the Daily News, Ian Hummerston, to become a journalist. Cam negotiated that he would take a pay cut. Now he was working during daylight hours during the last 3 years of his degree. This fact assisted him to complete the degree in 1981. Cam’s wife and children and his father attended his graduation ceremony. He was presented with his degree by the Chancellor D. H. Aitken who was also Chairman of the Main Roads Department. 37:19 Cam negotiated to report as a graded journalist and the editors knew that he could write and had life experience and contacts. He started off doing general reporting. His first story was on heatwave conditions in WA. He had already learned the importance of maintaining relationships. The job was a shared experience and very immediate. 41:36 Cam covered a lot of the tax avoidance stories that were prevalent at that time. Also the garbage collectors’ strike. He did the environment round and a column called “Bird Watch” during the drought in about 1978 or 1979. His university contacts were from Murdoch or Curtin. UWA was more conservative. 45:13 After environment he did industrial relations and then was made the Daily News political reporter in about 1984 when John Arthur left for Canberra. Cam would attend the Labor Party public meetings if John was away and always covered the Trades & Labour Council meetings. John was tenacious and followed Sir Charles Court around doggedly in 1982 as he had got wind of Court’s impending retirement. His persistence led to Sir Charles Court calling him in and giving him the scoop. Court was succeeded by Ray O’Connor who was known to Cam from campaigning in East Perth and playing football for East Perth. Cam has made no secret of his political affiliations as he considers it dishonest to do so. 50:16 Politicians regularly contact journalists to present their case. The journalist must enquire beyond what is given to them. Politicians also invite the media to the opening of new infrastructure projects. In 1983, when Brian Burke was elected Premier, he established a practice of taking the Cabinet to the community and would fly them and a media contingent to places such as Albany or Kalgoorlie to hold Cabinet meetings. This was not standard practice. 53:53 Cam had his own office in WAN but in Parliament the journalists shared offices. Cam was very rarely in his office at the newspaper. He generally had about 8 assignments per day and would phone in the news from Parliament House, the Trades & Labour Centre or the Courts. 56:09 When he had “writer’s block”, he would write a human interest story. One of his first stories involved interviewing the parents of a young violinist who had died in a traffic accident. Another involved pet rocks! 60:48 The editors and sub editors would check the copy. Cam had done a bit of that occasionally as relief work and if he worked on the Saturday paper. He preferred journalism as he liked to be out of the office and meeting new people. 63:35 Interview 2 Track 1 00:00 Introduction by Julia Wallis 00:38 Track 2 00:00 Journalist (1978-1985). While on Cam’s rounds one day he was visiting Premier Brian Burke’s press secretary, Ron Barry, who suggested that Cam work as media secretary to Peter Dowding. His fellow journalists thought he had gone over to the dark side! At his leaving party he was told he wrote without personal or political bias. 06:25 Worked closely with Peter Dowding’s private staff. Told Peter Dowding he would not lie to the media and that he required access to him as Minister whenever he needed it. Much of his work centred on industrial relations, employment and training issues. 11:05 He gave guidance to how ministers and policy officers framed things. He tried to imagine how announcements would impact on the public. There were several industrial issues at the time - strikes in the Pilbara, etc. His role was to be a sounding board and to guide and ‘protect’ the minister. Handling television media was a significant part of the role. Print, radio and TV all have a spatial context requiring a set time to get your message across. 16:28 Cam met Brian Burke at WAN. In this job he liaised with Brian Burke through his press secretaries and sometimes with him personally. Burke established a meaningful government media office. It caused better co-ordination and helped to enhance the solidarity of Cabinet but there were unscripted comments from time to time. 21:50 Cam trained the minister in how to be media savvy. Before a press conference, they would rehearse what some of the questions might be. Brian Burke understood the importance of having a Cabinet that looked presentable. Cam was responsible for Ernie Bridge when he became a Minister in 1986. He was the first Indigenous Minister and was very personable. Cam believes his contribution to UWA was to build a more responsible and flexible culture and to communicate the university’s vision. 29:56 The stock market crash of 1987 impacted on Perth, WA and on the State Government. The Rothwells rescue was put in place. Unfortunately the Government was not in full possession of the facts. Brian Burke had decided to leave in early 1988. There were four emerging leaders: Peter Dowding, Julian Grill, Bob Pearce and David Parker. 34:23 Peter Dowding’s office worked hard to make him palatable as a successor to Brian Burke. He was announced as Premier in late 1987 but was in a holding pattern until Brian Burke left in 1988. The Rothwells controversy was by then at its height and took 6 months to discover the scale of the problem. 39:41 Cam then became Press Secretary to the Premier. Brian Burke was a very hard act to follow as he was a consummate media performer. Peter Dowding was also very good with the media and a good and clear thinker. The “Dowding’s Working” campaign re launched him after about 6 months as a hard worker and a man of the people. This created a sense of change. Peter Dowding’s first budget was a social budget but they couldn’t build on it as he began to white-anted from within his own party. 45:50 In the end, Peter Dowding could not resist the internal and external campaigns against him. Premier Dowding went to the World Economic Forum in Davos in 1990 to showcase Western Australia. Politics in Europe were at a very interesting stage with the dismantling of the Berlin Wall while back in Perth the knives were out for him. 49:05 Caucus voted him out but the deal was that Carmen Lawrence would retain David Parker as Deputy Leader. Cam believes that David Parker should have been encouraged to resign so that the Lawrence Government would have some distance from WA Inc. Carmen Lawrence did not want to retain Cam as he was viewed as being too close to Peter Dowding. He worked for TAFE WA as Public Affairs Manager for about 9 months. 55:29 In late 1991, Carmen Lawrence asked Cam to be Principal Private Secretary (now called Chief of Staff) for Dr Judyth Watson. She was a new Minister who came in when Gavan Troy was sacked and her office was a mish-mash of staff from previous ministers. Her portfolio mix was all people orientated and the demands were great. There was also the wash up from Western Women and Robin Greenburgh. Other issues were Mabo, Aboriginal Deaths in Custody, Marandoo and Yakabindie. Cam had to unify the office. 1:02:26 There was a very good press report from Judith Watson’s visit to Marandoo and she won back a lot of respect in Cabinet. 1:07:12 A year later he was asked to become Director of Policy in the Office of the Premier. Cabinet was fractured due to the Penny Easton affair. Despite their best efforts the Government lost the 1993 election to Richard Court. 1:12:42 Cam could have stayed working for the incoming Government but he decided to leave. He was offered a job on the ABC working on the current affairs morning radio programme. Interview 3 Track 1 00:00 Introduction by Julia Wallis 00:55 Track 2 Cam was producer of the ABC morning current affairs programme from April 1993 to August 1996. At the same time, he was doing coaching work – managing leaders and senior executives for government agencies or law firms and so on. UWA approached him this way. They were at a cross roads. There had been a failed merger plan between UWA and Murdoch in 1988/89. Fay Gale had been appointed the first female Vice Chancellor. She was a strong feminist who believed in fairness and equity and she had been experiencing some hostility to her appointment and the changes that she was trying to make. At the same time, an issue known as the “Rindos affair” had split the university. UWA was getting bad press. 05:11 Alan Robson, the Deputy Vice Chancellor and Malcolm Orr, the Registrar tried to put out the fires. Cam gave some initial advice and was eventually appointed as Director of Public Affairs in 1996. The culture and management style of UWA at this time was conservative. They had no coherent strategy to deal with these sorts of problems. Cam insisted his office was separate from the Vice-Chancellery. Cam realised UWA’s culture must change and that the public and the media needed to have access to the university. 09:37 Cam decided that he was going to make internal relations more informal. There seemed to be an inability to act in a timely fashion in relation to issues and he felt that the university was operating in a cocoon. Cam encouraged the academics to co-operate and participate with the media. He made his office the first port of call for the Australian media, particularly in relation to research programmes. He used his contacts in the media and politics to enable UWA academics to take part in conferences. He did a review after 4 years and discovered that roughly 500-600 UWA staff had been quoted in the media on an annual basis. The media have space to fill and are looking for good talent. Cam was able to deliver them on time and built up a good relationship with the media. 15:20 Cam had a good PA but ran a lean office so that he was not accused of wasting university funds. When the academics realised that community service was part of being considered for promotion they were more prepared to get involved. Fay was highly respected by the women in the university as she promoted a lot of women to leadership roles. She was respected nationally and internationally. The Howard Government reduced Commonwealth funding to universities and Fay championed the importance of higher education. 20:24 The other part of Cam’s role was to revamp the outreach programme of the university – UWA Press, Extension, the museums and galleries and the Festival. He proposed that an umbrella be placed over all of these different aspects of UWA. Fay recruited Professor Margaret Seares in 1997. She was a UWA music graduate and had been head of music. She had managed the Department of Culture and the Arts in Western Australia. She was appointed Chair of the Australia Council part-time and worked for UWA part time as Executive Director, Community Relations to promote UWA’s interests. 24:06 Cam believes that the Rindos affair got out of control and that people became entrenched in their positions. He puts this down to lack of communication and unwillingness to understand the issue. It got so bad that there was an Upper House enquiry of the Legislative Council. He advised Fay Gale to tell the enquiry that as Chancellor, she was responsible for all decisions made by the university. This took the wind out of their sails to some extent. There was a headline to this effect in the West Australian. The death of David Rindos in 1996 effectively ended the controversy. 29:50 The faculties viewed the administration as becoming too big and taking over their patch. Consultation was paramount in order to make sure that everyone felt that they had some input. Committee structures needed reform as it took too long to effect changes. The inertia was also evident in other parts of the university. Alan Robson and Fay Gale had a plan to buy out senior staff and give them a good package in order that they could retire with some integrity and dignity and so that the university could bring in people with fresh ideas. Alan Robson and Fay Gale decided that UWA should aim to be one of the top 100 universities in the world by the time of the centenary in 2013 and to be within the top 50 within fifty years. 34:57 Cam was doing this job for 10 years. He then went to a 3 day week as Principal Adviser External Relations and Advocacy. Advocacy was the buzz word and he became more of a lobbyist. Fay Gale left in 1997 and Deryck Schreuder was appointed. Cam’s role was to support the Executive and give them self-belief and honest advice. Cam believes that Deryck Schreuder did not achieve as much as he wanted to at UWA as he had some personal issues – not least that his wife remained living in Sydney. Alan Robson remained as Deputy Vice Chancellor and remained responsible for the running of internal issues. 40:10 Deryck Schreuder wanted UWA to be more engaged with the community. Fay Gale did 3 significant things in her last year – she committed to the air conditioning of Winthrop Hall; she committed to building a University Club and she established the Fay Gale Scholarship for UWA staff. They appointed a Director of Management Events to help engage with the community. In 1999, the established the Parents Welcome. Another significant thing was the celebration every two years for those who had donated their mortal remains to science. This involved their relatives and the Anatomy students. 46:51 Towards the millennium, Deryck Schreuder was active on various boards and committees promoting the university nationally and internationally. On Valentine’s Day 2000 all those couples who had wedding photos taken and/or married on campus were invited back to UWA for an afternoon tea. They got a front page human interest story in The West Australian. Cam used his media background to get people to talk about the university in ways other than just about research and the students. 50:15 The 2000 Festival of Perth was one of the most significant but went over budget. Managing this was quite sensitive. Perth could have lost its Festival and the university its community outreach. It was Seán Doran first festival. The role is now split into two roles to enable the artistic director to take care of the arts side and a manager who oversees the finances. 55:40 UWA established a Clinical Evaluation Training Centre along the same lines of ones that had been established in the UK. This was opened by the Queen in about January 2000. Significant funders were introduced to the university as a result of this event. It enabled the university to extend its invitation list to all the significant people around Perth including the State Governor and the politicians. 01:01:15 More capital works followed. In 2002, Cam approved the interviews for would be Big Brother contestants to take place in Winthrop Hall. It made the university look a little less aloof. Another controversial event was the Pangaea conference in about 1999. Cam feels that universities have a role in facilitating discussion and debate – not matter how controversial – and can provide a neutral environment. 01:06:31 A key event was Alan Robson recruiting Barry Marshall back to Perth and UWA. Geoff Gallop opened the Motorola Building in 2003. This later became the Ken and Julie Michael Building . UWA internally funded the new Science Building at UWA that Geoff Gallop opened. Cam recalls when he heard through a Spanish journalist in 2005 that Barry Marshall had won the Nobel Prize. This was important for Barry Marshall and UWA. 01:15:35 Around this time, Cam did more external lobbying and attended State Political Conferences which had not been done before. Cam managed to organise a meeting with Kevin Rudd and the Senate before he was elected in 2007. When Stephen Smith became Foreign Affairs Minister he extended an invitation to the then US Secretary of State, Condoleezza Rice. Cam drafted a letter for Alan Robson extending an invitation to her if she ever visited WA. She did visit UWA in 2008. 01:21:54 In this period there were great developments in fund raising and outreach. Ex-UWA students such as Kim Beazley and Carmen Lawrence have been invited back to take up positions at UWA. This adds value to the university experience. In 2014, Stephen Smith became Winthrop Professor of Law at UWA. It is important that students see high achievers whether they be politicians or business leaders as people who were once students like them. It makes them realise that they too can achieve their goals and not lose their fundamental humanity. 01:25:43 To make UWA a top university, it was necessary to elevate the status of the university and make it more well-known. It was decided that UWA should be a centre of research excellence. Cam’s role was to publicise that this was their goal and get the message across to decision makers both in Australia and overseas. Recruitment was important; it was fortunate that Barry Marshall returned to UWA just before he won a Nobel Prize. If Cam went interstate he ensured he met with education journalists in Sydney, Melbourne and Canberra and also politicians and ministers. 01:29:45 Facilities were also important. From 1997 through to about 2002, approximately $5 million was made in capital investment including the University Club, the Science Building, the Business School and new libraries. Staff and students saw the value of this. Technologies were changing. Cam made a point of introducing himself to the new Guild President each year. The student experience was key and through them the alumni. There is a cultural precinct at UWA now. The student experience is far more valuable than when Cam was at university in the 1970s. Working in PR for a university is very satisfying because it is a good product. 01:34:52 Working for UWA was similar to politics in that Cam was working for leaders and he wanted to do the best for those people. Working for UWA is slightly more complicated than working for politicians. Academic freedom is a bit different to making decisions according to the party line. Cam enjoyed working for UWA. It was a good product, with good people and a common thread of community service. The campus was inspiring and seeing young people blossom and the beauty of the grounds made working there a joy. He is appreciative of all the people he worked with and for at UWA. 01:43:20 Watching the eulogies for Gough Whitlam on television last night (21 October 2014) made him realise how visionary Gough Whitlam was. He was elected in 1972 which was Cam’s first year at UWA. Cam is concerned about the current financial situation and the lack of focus on university funding. He hopes that UWA will remain open to all sections of society. UWA is now 88th in the world and it is hoped that will get in the top 50. UWA must not shut itself off from the public but remain open and accessible. 01:48:39 Audio Files Links to audio files <a href="http://oralhistories.arts.uwa.edu.au/files/original/476d6370702955b3cec104308ece09f3.mp3">Campbell-Fraser, Interview 1, Track 1</a> <br /><a href="http://oralhistories.arts.uwa.edu.au/files/original/1c15c8b2f34fc55ce64c4d2e2262850f.mp3">Campbell-Fraser, Interview 1, Track 2</a> <br /><a href="http://oralhistories.arts.uwa.edu.au/files/original/5fcea024b22ba2d7dfa1ade7f09f49cc.mp3">Campbell-Fraser, Interview 2, Track 1</a> <br /><a href="http://oralhistories.arts.uwa.edu.au/files/original/10cb33be9f5372a6cd79a9bcfc96cd99.mp3">Campbell-Fraser, Interview 2, Track 2</a> <br /><a href="http://oralhistories.arts.uwa.edu.au/files/original/ddb10b1877d2269eff50bcf4273b421f.mp3">Campbell-Fraser, Interview 3, Track 1</a> <br /><a href="http://oralhistories.arts.uwa.edu.au/files/original/defaf4733467562b42b38fb303a91743.mp3">Campbell-Fraser, Interview 3, Track 2</a> <br /><a href="http://oralhistories.arts.uwa.edu.au/files/original/18e4af0397a12537b976a230f7ae74c0.mp3">Campbell-Fraser, Interview 3, Track 3</a> Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Colin Campbell-Fraser interview, 8 October 2014, 14 October 2014 and 22 October 2014 Subject The topic of the resource Public Affairs Description An account of the resource Colin Campbell-Fraser is a UWA Graduate and prior to taking the role of Director of Public Affairs at UWA in 1996 he enjoyed a successful career as a senior journalist, media producer and policy and media advisor to various Ministers and Premiers at a state level. Colin retired from his role as Principal Advisor for External relations at UWA in 2011 but he maintains strong links to UWA as a Member of UWA's Council of Convocation. Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Campbell-Fraser, Colin Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available University of Western Australia Historical Society Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource Copyright holder University of Western Australia Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource MP3 files Type The nature or genre of the resource Oral History Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource UWA ORAL HISTORIES Description An account of the resource A collection of interviews with former UWA staff, recorded by the <a href="http://www.alumni.uwa.edu.au/community/historical-society" target="_blank">UWA Historical Society</a> to mark the Centenary of the University in 2013. <br />The UWA Historical Society’s <a href="http://www.alumni.uwa.edu.au/community/historical-society/oral-histories" target="_blank">Oral History Program</a> started as a project with four oral histories funded from Society resources. It was then expanded with support from every Faculty on campus, the Guild, Convocation and through private donations. Additional funding was received through a Heritage Grant. Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available University of Western Australia Historical Society Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource University of Western Australia Historical Society Oral History A resource containing historical information obtained in interviews with persons having firsthand knowledge. Interviewer The person(s) performing the interview Julia Wallis Interviewee The person(s) being interviewed Peter Grigg Location The location of the interview Claremont, W.A. Duration Length of time involved (seconds, minutes, hours, days, class periods, etc.) 56 minutes, 52 seconds Bit Rate/Frequency Rate at which bits are transferred (i.e. 96 kbit/s would be FM quality audio) 128 kbs Time Summary A summary of an interview given for different time stamps throughout the interview Track 1 00:00 Introduction by Julia Wallis 00:50 Track 2 00:00 Peter John Grigg was born on 7 June 1925. He started his schooling at Darlington State School aged 6 and then went to Hale School. He joined the Royal Australian Navy in 1942. Peter’s older brother was an architectural student and he had thought that he could do engineering and work with him but he was killed at Kokoda. Peter’s father was a builder. At the end of the Second World War, Peter returned to Perth Technical College to do his matriculation. He got an Associate in Architecture from Perth Tech and became involved with various committees for the Royal Institute of Architects, especially on the practice committee. Because of this involvement, in 1971 he was invited by Roger Johnson who was the Reader and Acting Head of the School of Architecture at UWA, to become visiting lecturer for professional practice in the Fifth year. 06:00 The head of the school at Perth Technical College was Bill Robbie. The course involved construction, the history of architecture, plumbing, wood working, cabinet making, architecture drawing and drafting. Practical classes were held at Leederville Technical College on brick laying, timber work and painting. It was a very practical approach to architecture. Peter graduated in 1954 and started work at Cameron Chisholm and Nichol. Then he moved to Oldham Boas & Ednie-Brown where he remained for some years. He did commercial and residential work. Peter assisted with the drawings for South Fremantle Power Station. It was a strict brief. Structural engineers were involved in the project as well. The drawings were done manually on tracing paper or on fine linen that was used for drafting. All the drawing was done by hand in the days before computers. 11:23 Studio sessions at UWA consisted of a student being set a problem such as designing a 2 bedroom apartment. In those days sketch plans were submitted for the client’s approval. Peter taught the students professional practice in the 5th year and the law in relation to professional practice and contract drawings. This continued when he was a full-time member of staff. He lectured on the responsibilities of the architect at common law and contract law. Parallel to that, Peter taught second year studio work in simple design programmes. He also lectured in building construction. Margaret Pitt-Morison ran a history course; Peter Bruechle taught introduction to engineering problems associated with building. Plumbing consultants were part-time visiting lecturers. Some of the attitudes from Perth Tech were carried over to WAIT and thence to UWA. The studio teaching method was popular around the world. A lot of students liked to build models. A three dimensional model was used to explain to clients how the building would look. Computer design has now replaced the need for models. 17:03 When Peter came to UWA, Roger Johnson was Head of School. There was no Professor as such because Professor Gordon Stephenson was busy doing other things. The department was located in temporary ex-army buildings near the Sunken Garden. In second year, Peter had approximately 15-20 students; often the majority were females. A few dropped off during the course and had to repeat years. It was a demanding course. The students would do their studio work after hours to complete projects. Each student had a work station and a drawing board. The course did not include a practical component but Peter took his 2nd year students to building sites at weekends to reinforce the lectures. He also took students to Rottnest for sketching and he held an art week at York where they did clay modelling, painting and live drawing classes to develop their artistic skills. 23:21 UWA had a number of visiting lecturers as they had a limited staff ratio and budget. The visitors could take subjects that the staff did not have the skill to teach. Peter did not attend staff meetings until he became full-time. John White came from WAIT. Roger Johnson was Gordon Stephenson’s planning assistant in the plan for UWA. Cal Green was a general lecturer. Derek Carruthers brought his expertise in acoustics to the school and headed up building science. Geoff Roy was the computer whizz. Peter did a sabbatical year in Britain and visited offices that were using computers. 27:18 When Peter was teaching at UWA the only architectural courses in Perth were run by WAIT and UWA. When the School of Architecture at UWA started in 1968, it was agreed that they would accept Fourth Year students from WAIT. Peter thought both courses were equally good. David Stanton from WAIT published some good works and Peter consulted with him on issues to do with course work. The courses were similar. Town Planning was not a strongly developed unit at UWA despite the interest of Professor Gordon Stephenson. It would have been covered in the course on professional practice. Planning legislation would have been taught in 5th year. Landscape architecture was taught part-time by the university landscape architect. Roger Johnson devised the colour scheme for the UWA buildings being cream and orange. 33:13 A visiting lecturer who came from Denmark espoused that buildings could claim the site or merge with the site. The students were taught “good mannered” architecture – i.e. to be sensitive to the streetscape. In the days before exhaust fans, designing buildings was quite tricky due to regulations regarding ventilation and light. Designing a building to take account of sunshade and shade was also taught. 39:17 Students sometimes had to work on joint projects. The studio situation took over the role of the tutorial and students got one to one attention. Peter did not enjoy setting exam papers. Most of the students got jobs. They did not necessarily have to become architects but could use the expertise they had learnt to take them into different areas. 43:25 Visiting scholars arrived on a fairly regular basis. Some of the UWA students did a semester in Denmark which exposed them to European architecture. A lecturer from Denmark also visited and taught studio work. The students all wanted to travel to Europe. Some Perth Tech students went to work in London straight after graduating. Architecture trends were taught in architectural history. John White, Ralph Drexel and Cal Green would have all been involved with this. 46:55 Architectural schools in Australia would be inspected each cycle (perhaps every 3-5 years) and the inspectors had to approve the course. The courses did not change much over the 13 years that Peter was teaching. The introduction of computers and building science were the biggest changes. The School was moved to its present location after Peter retired in 1985. 50:12 The School of Architecture was quite self-sufficient although Peter did mix socially with Martin Webb from Geography and Reg Moir from Agriculture. There was no inter-faculty engagement except perhaps with Engineering. Some of the students did extra units in courses outside of Architecture. Peter really enjoyed teaching his students. He often invited them to lunch and showed them the house that he had built in the final year he was at Perth Technical College. It was located at Mosman Park and had a northern exposure and sunlight control. Audio Files Links to audio files <a href="http://oralhistories.arts.uwa.edu.au/files/original/d6314a4b343e77f2578ec2d5bc39c7fa.mp3">Grigg, Interview 1, Track 1</a> <br /><a href="http://oralhistories.arts.uwa.edu.au/files/original/3870eb1116ed9b4f39c556dd103fd43e.mp3">Grigg, Interview 1, Track 2</a> Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Peter Grigg interview, 31 October 2014 Subject The topic of the resource Architecture Description An account of the resource Peter Grigg studied architecture at Perth Technical College. He graduated with an Associate in Architecture in 1954. After graduating, he worked in private practice for Cameron Chisholm & Nichol and later, Oldham Boas & Ednie-Brown. During this period he was involved with the design drawings for South Fremantle Power Station. In 1971, he was invited by Roger Johnson, Reader at the School of Architecture at UWA to lecture part-time. He became a full-time lecturer at UWA in 1975 and taught Professional Practice at the School of Architecture until his retirement in 1985. Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Grigg, Peter Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available University of Western Australia Historical Society Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource Copyright holder University of Western Australia Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource MP3 files Type The nature or genre of the resource Oral History Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource UWA ORAL HISTORIES Description An account of the resource A collection of interviews with former UWA staff, recorded by the <a href="http://www.alumni.uwa.edu.au/community/historical-society" target="_blank">UWA Historical Society</a> to mark the Centenary of the University in 2013. <br />The UWA Historical Society’s <a href="http://www.alumni.uwa.edu.au/community/historical-society/oral-histories" target="_blank">Oral History Program</a> started as a project with four oral histories funded from Society resources. It was then expanded with support from every Faculty on campus, the Guild, Convocation and through private donations. Additional funding was received through a Heritage Grant. Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available University of Western Australia Historical Society Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource University of Western Australia Historical Society Oral History A resource containing historical information obtained in interviews with persons having firsthand knowledge. Interviewer The person(s) performing the interview Julia Wallis Interviewee The person(s) being interviewed Peter Bruechle Location The location of the interview Wembley Downs, W.A. Duration Length of time involved (seconds, minutes, hours, days, class periods, etc.) Interview 1: 1 Hour 4 minutes, 6 seconds Interview 2:1 hour, 5 minutes, 44 seconds Total: 2 hours, 9 minutes, 50 seconds Bit Rate/Frequency Rate at which bits are transferred (i.e. 96 kbit/s would be FM quality audio) 128 kbs Time Summary A summary of an interview given for different time stamps throughout the interview Interview 1 Track 1 00:00 Introduction by Julia Wallis 00:29 Track 2 00:00 Peter’s father was from Switzerland. Peter’s grandfather was a mining engineer. Peter’s father was an electrician and was killed by a falling power pole in about 1954 when Peter was 22 years old. Peter was brought up by his grandmother in Welshpool and attended Queen’s Park State School. Peter’s uncle was running the electrical trades department at Perth Technical College. Peter decided to go into structures rather than become an electrician. He went to Forrest High School in Lord Street, East Perth to do his Junior. Then attended Perth Technical College for a year while Leederville Technical College was being built. Did his Leaving from Leederville Tech and won a scholarship to do Engineering at Perth Technical College. His Master was Erich Shilbury. Shirley Strickland taught Physics. After graduating, he was employed by the Architectural Department of the Public Works Department. 04:47 Perth Technical College was situated on St George’s Terrace. It had some older buildings behind it where Engineering and Chemistry were taught. There were a range of temporary buildings containing the canteen and a workshop. The Electrical Trades Department and the School of Architecture were housed in a new building on Terrace Drive. The architecture students were young whereas some of the Engineering students were mature, returned servicemen. Peter shared lectures with the architecture students and made friends with many of them which helped him later on in his career. Erich Shilbury had been a top engineer in Berlin and worked with Felix Samuely who went to work in London. Peter worked with Samuely in London later on. Shilbury had lectured in mathematics at Wesley College. 08:29 Peter graduated with an Associate in Structural Engineering (Civil) from Perth Technical College in 1953. He went to work for the Government. All of the major buildings in town were being constructed by the Public Works Department. Lew Harding was the Chief Engineer. It was a good job. Peter worked here for 2-3 years and then went to work in London. He worked with Samuely on the new American Embassy Building in Grosvenor Square and Brussels Exhibition buildings in 1958. The building work in London was more esoteric whereas the building work in Perth was more utilitarian. 13:13 Peter flew home and married his fiancée. He returned to work as a Senior Design Engineer with the Public Works Department from 1958-1961. [mobile phone rings] Peter feasted on European architecture such as the Player’s Theatre, a Victorian Music Hall. London still showed signs of bomb damage. A new town was being built at Harlow . Peter was not impressed with some of the building he saw here. Some of the construction was quite different to what he had been used to. He had had a year without pay and went back to designing high schools and such like for the Government. 18:15 Shilbury asked Peter to lecture at Perth Technical College part-time at night. He was working full-time and also running a private practice (PJ’s or private jobs) which you weren’t supposed to do. He took over Shilbury’s final year classes when he was on long service leave. Each government building was designed by a government architect. The principal architect was A E (Paddy) Clare. Government cadetships trained many of the architects around town. Architects and structural engineers worked together on buildings. Norm Gilchrist was the second in charge and became a partner in Bruechle Gilchrist and Evans. Peter also worked on State housing such as the block of flats on the corner of Hay and Outram Streets, West Perth. Neville Coulter was the architect. 24:51 Peter left the government in 1961 and set up in private practice. He rented a room in an office owned by architects Gus Ferguson and Tony Brand. The office was in St George’s House, now The Terrace Hotel. Brand & Ferguson broke up later and Tony Brand went to Forbes and Fitzhardinge as their chief design architect. Peter started taking over more and more of the building and went into partnership with Norm Gilchrist and Ernie Evans. The firm grew and they later moved to new premises in South Perth. Eric Moyle paid Peter for work he hadn’t done to keep him afloat. Moyle later left architecture and became an artist. Peter worked with Ken Broadhurst on car parks and the grandstand at Subiaco. 29:20 Structural engineers at the time were Don Fraser, Leon Halpern and George Kadifa. Peter had some issues with Gordon Barrett-Hill but they became friends. Now there are lots of engineers and architects. 32:44 Track 3 00:00 There were two ways to become an architect before the School of Architecture opened at UWA in 1968. You could do a course at Perth Tech or you could study for the Board exams. Peter ran private classes in structures for the Board students. The Board students were thought inferior to the Perth Tech students and all of them later compared to university educated students. 04:36 The first lecturer at the School of Architecture at UWA was Lew Harding. Gordon Stephenson asked Peter to lecture part-time in structures. Peter had designed part of the Physics building at UWA and had got to know Gordon. Peter also did the structure for the Economics building and Marshall Clifton was the architect. Gus Ferguson was the architect for the Law School and Peter designed the structure. There were about 6-8 staff members: John White, Cal Green, John Cullen, Peter Grigg and Professor Hugo Brunt. Structures were regarded as an offshoot. Architecture students did not enjoy the subject so Peter tried to make it interesting and relevant. He took them to building sites such as Central Park. People involved with Central Park would also give lectures. External people also gave lectures in Peter’s course such as Ken Baker from Halpern Glick, George Kadifa, Gordon Barrett-Hill and Wally King, the State Manager of Leighton. 10:54 The core components of the course were materials, applied mechanics and how structures work, sizing hints and so on. Structures did not work in with the utilities. The services tend to run the design concept today. It is a lot more integrated now that computers are used. Peter stopped teaching in 1997. He felt that once computers became popular in the early 90s that he should move on. They did not use models. Computers enable people to design things because they can rather than because they should! He is not a fan of Frank Gehry! Peter feels buildings should have function. 16:38 The Law School at UWA is a first class building. Peter is also enamoured of Allendale Square. He is proud of Central Park. Problems around the building of the core of Central Park were used as a practical demonstration tool for the students. Buildings are problematic after 30 stories. They have to be built strong enough to withstand wind and earthquake, etc. To compensate for that, you need to have a strong core to stiffen the building. 22:00 There is an art to designing really tall buildings. Peter worked on Emirates Tower in Dubai. Emerging communities build tall buildings to show off their prowess but they are not particularly practical. 26:28 Exams were mandatory and Peter set the papers and marked them. He did not enjoy this but he does think that it is a good system of testing. Exams were just part of assessment and the students also did assignments as well. 30:53 Interview 2 Track 1 00:00 Introduction by Julia Wallis 00:31 Track 2 00:00 Peter was impressed with the early buildings at UWA but some of the government buildings at UWA were done to budget. Gordon Stephenson employed architects that would design buildings more sympathetic to the university environment. Gus Ferguson designed the Law School and the Guild Building. Roger Johnson was the architect for the Economics School. Peter worked with Roger as design engineer on this building. Tony Brand designed the new Music School. To avoid escalating building costs, Tony and Peter decided the building should be constructed in pre-cast concrete. This was the first (and perhaps last) time this method was used on the UWA campus. Peter had been pushing for this material to be used more widely. Central Park and Exchange Plaza were both built with pre-cast concrete. The audio requirements of the Music School were very strict. Some of the modern buildings were the Engineering School designed by Gordon Finn. Peter was involved with some of the structure for the Physics Building when he was still working for the government. Many of these architects were influenced by modern design. 06:19 The School of Architecture was located in make-shift buildings off Fairway. The new school was designed by Gus Ferguson. Physics and Chemistry were done by Public Works. Peter does not like some of the modern buildings designed today. He regards the Law School as being very people friendly. Gus Ferguson spent a lot of time developing off-form materials. The Law School is highly regarded. Off-form concrete was very popular in England. The first off-form concrete building constructed in Australia was Hale School War Memorial Hall. Gus Ferguson was the architect. Inside, he made panels of bomb craters in concrete. He used the materials for the Law School in a different way to make it more liveable. There was a great deal of experimentation done in order to get the right colour concrete. Part of the Economics School was built in off form concrete. 12:24 The Arts Building was designed by Marshall Clifton. The engineer was Don Fraser. They had problems with the foundations. The Law School foundations were dug out and taken away and compacted sand was used for the new foundations. It was cheaper than digging holes. There was once a well on the site so it had to be blocked up. Today the problem would be solved by piling. The Sports Centre was designed by Gus Ferguson to a budget. It has an off form concrete frame with brick structure. Gordon Stephenson wanted all the buildings on campus to link together. Peter was not involved with the new School of Architecture building. 16:54 The buildings at Murdoch university were designed by Gus Ferguson. Peter did some structures at Curtin with Gus Ferguson. A major building was the Administration Building and Tony Brand was the architect. Many of the buildings at Curtin were designed by the PWD architect using off form concrete (including the School of Architecture). Architecture is very much subject to the fashions of the time. The Reid Library at UWA was designed by Cameron Chisholm & Nicol. It is similar to the National Library in Canberra. 21:28 When Gordon Finn designed the engineering school the buildings had roof trusses. Peter learned how to use rigid frames – now known as portal frames. Ferguson used boards with grooves in to hold them together with a slip tongue. Later, compressible plastic foam was used to minimise leakage. Laminated timber did not take off due to problems with the glues. The arches at Hale School are laminated timber. Innovations always cost a lot of money until it is worked out how to do it properly. Pre-cast concrete was used successfully in the Arabian Gulf. Floor could be erected very quickly. 28:08 The climate in the Middle East is very harsh and regulations not as strict. The building industry in Australia is now over-regulated. Personal responsibility is a thing of the past. The concrete was mixed with ice in the Middle East. Most of the concreting took place from 11pm when it was cooler. Desert winds blow sand and dust into the cities. When Peter first went to Dubai in 1972 it was very primitive. At that time, Saudi Arabia was the place that was developing. The tallest building in Dubai was the Hilton Hotel which was 2 storeys. When he returned in 1997 he was amazed by the changes. Peter worked on the Emirates Tower with Derek Robson from Multiplex. There were problems with the concrete that had to be sorted out. 40:15 Construction is a team game and needs to be played as such. Low fees mean people cut corners. Clear lines of authority and responsibility must be established. The construction of Kewdale High School was a team effort. Peter is regularly invited to arbitrate in construction disputes. The Redemptorist Retreat House in North Perth is a new building constructed from old bricks. Rob Campbell turned Fremantle Asylum into an Arts Centre. All the floors needed re-doing. The chimneys and roof structures had to be strengthened. Peter’s rule in BG&E was they could do things they didn’t like and make money; they could do things they liked and lose money; but that they wouldn’t do things that they didn’t like and lose money! 47:47 Peter loved many of his jobs particularly the Music and Law Schools at UWA; Exchange Plaza and of course Central Park due to its innovation. Traditional buildings and Roman and Japanese architecture are inspirational. Inspirational design engineers were Erich Shilbury, Felix Samuely, Norm Gilchrist and Ernest Evans. 54:06 Climate was a factor in construction projects in the North West due to extreme heat or cyclones. Peter was involved with the construction of accommodation at Newman for Leightons. Sir Charles Court insisted that these were permanent towns. Peter also designed a railway tower and shunting yard. Eco sensitive building was never part of the brief, although in Newman he suggested houses be built with concrete materials sourced locally rather than bricks from Perth. Kingston Tower in Canberra was built with pre-cast concrete made in South Australia. 01:01:19 Peter finds adjudicating on construction matters very difficult as the system is so adversarial. He has recently been made an Honorary Fellow of the Institute of Engineers. He would like to see more teamwork in the construction industry and more selection on merit rather than on money. 01:05:13 Audio Files Links to audio files <a href="http://oralhistories.arts.uwa.edu.au/files/original/b494929c312a53a0e1027906522d4b9a.mp3">Bruechle, Interview 1, Track 1</a> <br /><a href="http://oralhistories.arts.uwa.edu.au/files/original/c55cca43cee8bb9c45e6c466d29bda20.mp3">Bruechle, Interview 1, Track 2</a> <br /><a href="http://oralhistories.arts.uwa.edu.au/files/original/df8ad8d43ce661c7fa3a6e05e4913ef8.mp3">Bruechle, Interview 1, Track 3</a> <br /><a href="http://oralhistories.arts.uwa.edu.au/files/original/1da1ecd4564c6263e64c7a928afc065e.mp3">Bruechle, Interview 2, Track 1</a> <br /><a href="http://oralhistories.arts.uwa.edu.au/files/original/7b3642338b06e71023b21a5ff749cc51.mp3">Bruechle, Interview 2, Track 2</a> Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Peter Bruechle interview, 5 November 2014 and 12 November 2014 Subject The topic of the resource Architecture Description An account of the resource Peter Bruechle’s father and uncle were electricians but Peter decided to become an engineer. He studied engineering at Perth Technical College where he shared some classes with the architecture students. After graduating, he worked for the Public Works Department building houses and schools before taking a year off to work in London. When he returned to Perth, he worked for the Government again before leaving to set up in private practice. He was managing director of the Consulting Group, Bruechle, Gilchrist & Evans, which he founded, from 1961 until his retirement from it in 1997. In 1997, he was appointed Design Manager on the Emirates Tower in Dubai, which when completed, was the tallest building in Europe and the Middle East. He taught at Perth Technical College on a part-time basis for ten years and lectured on structures on a part-time basis at the School of Architecture at the University of Western Australia for in excess of thirty five years (approximately 1962-1997). Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Bruechle, Peter Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available University of Western Australia Historical Society Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource Copyright holder University of Western Australia Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource MP3 files Type The nature or genre of the resource Oral History