4 10 85 Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource UWA ORAL HISTORIES Description An account of the resource A collection of interviews with former UWA staff, recorded by the <a href="http://www.alumni.uwa.edu.au/community/historical-society" target="_blank">UWA Historical Society</a> to mark the Centenary of the University in 2013. <br />The UWA Historical Society’s <a href="http://www.alumni.uwa.edu.au/community/historical-society/oral-histories" target="_blank">Oral History Program</a> started as a project with four oral histories funded from Society resources. It was then expanded with support from every Faculty on campus, the Guild, Convocation and through private donations. Additional funding was received through a Heritage Grant. Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available University of Western Australia Historical Society Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource University of Western Australia Historical Society Oral History A resource containing historical information obtained in interviews with persons having firsthand knowledge. Interviewer The person(s) performing the interview Julia Wallis Interviewee The person(s) being interviewed Peter Handford Location The location of the interview Nedlands, W.A. Duration Length of time involved (seconds, minutes, hours, days, class periods, etc.) Interview 1: 1 hour, 21 minutes, 35 seconds Interview 2: 1 hour, 29 minutes, 59 seconds Total: 2 hours, 51 minutes, 34 seconds Bit Rate/Frequency Rate at which bits are transferred (i.e. 96 kbit/s would be FM quality audio) 128 kbs Time Summary A summary of an interview given for different time stamps throughout the interview Interview 1: Thursday 6 December 2012 Track 1 00:00 Introduction by Julia Wallis 00:30 Track 2 00:00 Peter Robert Handford. Winthrop Professor, Law School, UWA. Born Birmingham 29 October 1946. 00:16 Took 11 plus and went to Grammar School. Offered a place at King Edwards School aged 13. Direct grant school – equivalent to Perth Modern School. There from September 1960 to July 1965. 01:59 Went to Birmingham University to read law. Graduated in 1968. 02:52 1968 graduated with LLB. Formed intention to get an academic job. Applied for and got a place at Cambridge for a postgraduate degree. Did 1 year of course work and 1 year of research 03:56 At the end of 1970 took a position as a lecturer at Leicester University. Thesis turned into PhD and graduated in 1975. 04:36 English degree is normally 3 years and is a straight law degree. Did more working and studying alone. Clear difference between academic and professional stage. Attend a college of law to be a solicitor followed by articles. Academic and professional stages in Australia are not so separated. Also more common in England for students to go to university away from their home town. 07:39 Studied at Trinity Hall in Cambridge. Very good reputation. Got Thomas Waraker Law Postgraduate Scholarship. 08:15 Got a job at Leicester University which was a small university with a new law school (started in 1966). Now a very big and very successful law school. Twelve staff. There from 1970-1978. Then left to come to UWA. 09:28 Leicester University was one of 30 law schools. Oxford, Cambridge, London at the top. Warwick was another new law school. A lot of polytechnics that had law courses were upgraded to universities. This made 80-90 law schools. The old established law schools from the 1970s and 1980 are better regarded. 11:29 Track 3 00:00 Entitled to a term of study leave after 6 years at Leicester University (1976-77). Peter elected to take the summer term off and join a university in Australia or NZ. Also had an offer from University of Auckland. 02:27 Attracted to WA and knew it was developing and had a good cricket team. 03:04 Accepted UWA offer to teach for 6 months. Arrived in March 1977. Married with 2 children. Family arrived a few weeks later. 04:35 Looked after by Professor Douglas Payne. Watched the conclusion of the Centenary Test match at his home. Got some vacation time in between that enable him to tour the Eastern States. 06:00 Originally came for 6 months but he and his family enjoyed Perth. A job was on offered and he applied for it and was offered it without an interview. Returned to England in October 1977 and emigrated in June 1978. By now Peter had 3 children. He was able to teach the second term of July 1978. 08:09 When Peter was on study leave he stayed in a town house at Kingswood College. When they came back in 1978 the family stayed in a university house in Caporn Street. Then they rented a house for 6 months from Peter Johnston while he was on study leave. They bought a house in Hardy Street, Nedlands and then moved to Wembley. Nedlands was too expensive for an academic salary. 10:47 The Tuart Club loaned them some furniture and equipment on both occasions. 12:42 First impressions of UWA. Bright and beautiful. Winthrop Hall was like a cathedral. Leicester University was smaller and not so spectacular. 1960s buildings. UWA Law School going since 1928 – more solidly established and more akin to University of Birmingham. 15:30 The campus made a definite impression plus positive impressions of Perth. Like being on holiday. Loaned a car and were able to tour around. 16:21 Track 4 00:00 UWA Law School in 1977/78. Quota of 110 students a year. 4 year course. Birmingham had 100 students in Peter’s graduation year and UWA had 40. 02:03 Located opposite Arts Building. Law Link was not there and the open space was where students played cricket. Economics and Commerce moved out 2-3 years ago and Law spread into their space. 03:13 19 staff members. 4 support staff. The student common room is now the Moot Hall. Law lecture theatre has been realigned and tiered. Staff Library is now a tutorial room and the staff library is in the Law Link Building. 05:12 The Law Library an integral part of the Law School. In Leicester it was part of the general library. The library has been extended outwards toward the Oak Lawn. 06:23 Dean was Professor Eric Edwards taught Criminal Law and Evidence. Taught the American way. Prof Douglas Payne had come out from England in 1963 to take over from Professor Beasley. He was Dean until 1970 until unseated. There were not 3-5 year appointments in those days. 09:12 Two Associate Professors. Richard Harding later became full professor and Dean in 1981. Francis Auburn came in 1978. Retired in about 2000. 10:34 6 senior lecturers. Louis Proksch, Neville Crago. Louis was Dean 1981-1984. Two Englishmen. About half were English trained. 11:56 Not so hard to transfer between England and Australia. Australian law founded on English law. Constitutional law is different. 12:44 Frank Rixon taught tax and company law. A hard marker. Anthony Dickey taught jurisprudence and then became expert in family law. Peter Johnston taught constitutional law and also practised. Robert French a graduate who has had a distinguished career. Les Stein taught planning law. 15:06 A number of other lecturers were Derek Chantler (commercial); Stephen Owen-Conway; Val McAuliffe (nee Kerruish) (jurisprudence and conflict of laws). Peter Handford replaced her when on study leave. First female academic appointed to law school. Bill Ford (originally law school librarian); Dean from 2001-2011. Tony Wilson temporary lecturer taught property. Liza Newby was a tutor (criminology). Picked Peter up from the airport. 18:08 There had tutors on temporary appointments. Andrew Alston and Stan Jacobsen had been replaced when Peter returned permanently by Jeremy Allanson and Robin Tapper. 18:40 Librarians in the law library. The situation of Bill Ford. 20:27 Track 5 00:00 The structure of the law degree in 1977-78. Explanation of articles. 03:40 Big change in education in WA in 1970. Restricted practice introduced after admission. 04:55 Discussion of American system. UWA law school took over exams. Practice and procedure. Commercial practice. 07:24 This system changed in 1990. Joint degrees. 09:10 New system from 2013 will be the JD. 10:24 Subjects studied in the law degree. Full units and half units. Optional units. 11:58 Discussion of semesterisation 13:11 Teaching methods – lectures and tutorials. Impact of increased students. Need to go to venues outside the law school for lectures. 14:31 The practical element of the law course. Drafting documents. Many teachers are legal practitioners who come in and teach part time. 15:09 Vacation clerkships. Time poor to take advantage of study and university life generally. 16:33 Track 6 00:00 The students. Mix of matured aged people. President of Blackstone Society, Stephen Smith, now Minister of Defence. Unlike England where students scattered to the four winds. In Perth, you bump into ex-students on the Terrace. 03:02 Male/female mix. Not so great a number of female students in the 1970s. Mary Ann Yeats. Famous graduates were Christine Wheeler, Carmel McLure. In the 1990s female students eclipsed male students. 05:22 Attempts by UWA to get more mix in student intake. Dux scheme and Aboriginal bridging course. 06:59 Traditional rivalry with the Engineering faculty going back for generations. 07:57 Blackstone Society. Dinners. 08:54 R U Barking – pub crawl. The event no longer takes place. 10:34 Guild Council – Robert French, Jim McGinty. Daryl Williams was Guild President. 11:30 PROSH – seems to happen away from the Law School. 12:18 Sport. Alan Barblett – Olympic hockey. Rebecca French. 13:34 Time and financial pressure means activities outside study are less common. 1960s & 1970s the Golden Years of being a student. 15:07 Class times. Classes generally between 8am and 6pm. LLM classes held at weekends or in the evening or intensively. There are repeat lectures and several different class times on a subject during the day. 16:45 Track 7 00:00 Conclusion 00:15 Interview 2: Thursday 13 December 2012 Track 1 00:00 Introduction by Julia Wallis 00:30 Track 2 00:00 The period from July 1978 to May 1983. Full time member of the staff of the Law School. Anthony Dickey elected Dean in 1979. 3 way contest for this position at this time. Anthony Dickey wanted to appoint a Sub Dean who had a particular responsibility for students. Before the Dean had done everything. PRH was the first Sub Dean from January 1979 to 1982. 03:13 Duties to deal with student queries of all sorts; exams; admissions; advising the Barristers’ Board. Law School advised on overseas qualifications. 04:22 After a couple of years an office was created for the Sub Dean. 05:52 PRH taught many subjects filling in for other people. In 1980 he was teaching 5 different subjects. He also did research and published papers. 05:23 Attempted to gain promotion from lecturer to senior lecturer. Had to be at the university for 3 years. The Dean and Professor Payne advised him to apply for promotion a year earlier but he was rejected (Due to the 3 year rule). Rule 2 meant that he was unable to apply for another 2 years. He duly reapplied in 1981 and was rejected as it was felt that he had not done enough to show progress since the original application in 1979. 08:12 PRH then stepped down as Sub Dean in order to do more researching and writing. An alternative job came up as Executive Officer of the Law Reform Commission of Western Australia 08:55 PRH had applied for and was offered a job here in 1979 as Research Officer but this would have meant that he could not return to the UK in 1981 (when he had planned to return and do study leave). 09:52 He was interviewed on Christmas Eve 1982 and was offered the job. PRH had to work out 6 months’ notice. The new Dean Richard Harding allowed PRH to do part time teaching in order to take up this position after the first term. 11:19 As from May 1983 PRH left UWA for the Law Reform Commission. 11:33 In 1981 PRH was entitled to 6 months study leave after three years working at UWA and returned to the University of Leicester. It was like going back to his old life. He also did some part time teaching. The family travelled back on the eve of the Royal wedding (29 July 1981). One of the coldest winters on record. Encouraged the family to return to Perth for good in May 1983. 14:23 Track 3 00:00 May 1983 to February 1998 – Law Reform Commission (15 years) 01:40 Did not lose connection with Law School as he continued to teach. He finished teaching Legal Process in 1983 and he was asked to continue and did so for 15 years until he gave this up in 2007. From time to time, he was asked to do other teaching for the Law School such as Comparative Law, Conflict of Laws and Torts. He retained a room at the Law School as a part time teacher. Present at the Law School for 2-3 hours a week. 04:06 This had advantages to both work places. He also visited schools on behalf of the Law Reform Commission. 05:15 1980s was a productive time for Law Reform. From 1990 it became more difficult. There were a number of reviews and the Commission was under budgetary scrutiny and positions were gradually cut back. Four legal positions were lost. 05:55 In 1998 PRH returned to UWA. 06:09 Track 4 00:00 Returned to the full time staff of the University in 1998. The 1990s were difficult years at the Law Reform Commission. 00:41 1992-1995 good relations with Cheryl Edwardes – an ex student. 1993-1995 PRH also became a member of the Commission. 01:28 At the end of 1995, there was a Cabinet reshuffle and Peter Foss was appointed Attorney-General. He did not support the Law Reform Commission. He refused to renew the appointments of PRH and Carmel McClure who were due for reappointment at the end of 1995. 03:27 Three new members were then appointed - Wayne Martin, Ralph Simmonds, Robert Cock. They had a plan for reorganising the Commission and contracting out the work, shedding staff and dismantling the library. 04:12 This was a difficult period. From the middle of 1997 they were taking the Commission down and trying to find jobs for the staff. The highest up the totem pole was PJH and it was made clear to him that there was no comparable position for him in the public service. He applied for various academic positions interstate and overseas. 05:48 By the end of 1989/early 1990 he had a 25% fractional appointment at UWA. Before this he was paid casual rates. The current Dean, Ian Campbell, offered to turn this into a full time position. PRH returned as a full time member of staff at the UWA Law School in February 1998. 06:49 It was a seamless transition after the trauma of disbanding the LRC. 08:15 He came back as a senior lecturer. Ironically a word in the ear of the Dean in 1989 gave him promotion to at the stroke of a pen. 09:24 During his time at the LRC he had continued research and writing. He wrote a book with Nicholas Mullany on nervous shock. It was published in 1993. 10:49 This was done in a time before email and internet and drafts were handwritten. Things have changed a lot in 20 years. 11:10 This academic track record helped him to get back to UWA and to gain promotion to Associate Professor in 1999 and 5 years later (2004) to Professor. 11:58 He carried on teaching Legal Process and Torts. Has been back at the Law School for 15 years and is about to go fractional again as he winds down towards retirement. 12:47 There had been changes to the structure and syllabus of the degree. There had been changes made in 1990 to enable joint degrees. Murdoch Law School had opened. This system is about to change in 2013. 15:17 Move to semester length subjects. 16:16 Greater emphasis on exams – now an exam at the end of each semester rather than just at the end of the year. Also more emphasis on non-exam assessment. 18:50 The new course structure is also based on units lasting for a semester. Starting in 2012 every student does an undergraduate degree – BA, BSc, BComm, Bachelor of Design and Bachelor of Philosophy. Anything leading to a professional degree is now studied at postgraduate level. 20:36 Teaching methods had also changed. Ian Campbell the Dean in 1996 wanted more emphasis on small group teaching. Blueprint. 7 new appointments in order to run this program. 21:54 This indirectly led the Law School into financial difficulties. Bill Ford, the next Dean had to sort out the budgetary problems which he did very well. 22:32 The emphasis on small group teaching was to improve the educational experience. Torts are taught this way and sometimes Legal Process. It is two way teaching rather than an overblown tutorial. It works well but it is expensive. 24:36 Track 5 00:00 Syllabus had remained the same from 1990 to present. Administrative Law and Corporations Law that were once optional are now compulsory. This is due to the Priestley 11. Commercial practice is not part of the Priestley 11 but due to the fact that in the 1970s the Law School agreed to teach more practical subjects. 01:39 Some new compulsory areas will be introduced into the new JD such as Remedies, Legal Theory and Dispute Resolution. (Ethics is already a compulsory unit). UWA feels that these are essential subjects. 02:29 In 1998 there were more optional units such as Intellectual Property, Environmental Law, Corporate Finance and International Trade Law. 03:13 The LLM programme had been introduced since JRH was at UWA in the early 1980s. THE LLM is taught intensively at weekends or during a week. Centres of Expertise include mining energy and natural resources law and criminal justice. 04:47 The market for Taxation as a specialist subject has now disappeared. 04:58 Other changes included the way students study due to technological developments. The Law Library is excellent but now many of these resources can be found online. There is a wider selection of journals available now due to online resources. 07:20 Searching the sources can be done in hours rather than days. 07:50 Emails mean that it is easier to keep in touch but this can also be a burden. A lot course material is on the internet and each course has its own website. No printed material is given out to students any more. 08:37 UWA Law School has no virtual classrooms as yet. Lecturers are recorded. They can be shown in business centres at regional centres. Discussion groups and bulletin boards can take place online. 09:55 Some universities market online degrees. UWA prefers to have face to face contact with the students. 10:45 UWA is trying to increase places in colleges and accommodation near the University to provide a 24/7 university experience. 11:33 Fewer students attend lectures now as they can listen to lectures online. Staff discuss the pros and cons of this. The university is very keen to record lecture to help students who cannot attend but they don’t want this to take the place of contact on campus. 12:30 Attendance records are not always taken so it is hard to know who is attending but some classes are marked for turning up and participating. The best solution is to make the lectures so interesting that the students are keen to attend in person. 13:45 Track 6 00:00 Several units don’t have exams at all. Assessment is by means of class participation; take home exercise or research essays instead. When PRH arrived at UWA in 1977 he was struck by the fact that assessment was much more flexible than in the UK. 01:52 Exams in the Law School are anonymous. The rest of the university does not do this. It works very well in the Law School. 02:33 As more students are part time there is more demand for units to be completed over a longer period. Sometimes they want to defer units to go on exchange. Now students have to pass a certain number of subjects in the degree course however long it takes. There is much more flexibility now. 05:09 Exams have to be taken in one, or two rooms, altogether. There is great pressure on venues as all faculties have more students – including law. Special consideration can be given to students who have a clash due to other courses. 06:32 The results are sent to the students electronically. No longer are results posted on board exposed to public view. Staff don’t get a pass list so they often don’t know all the results for the students they teach. 09:10 The other law schools in Perth operate in a similar fashion. From 2013 there will be 5th law school when Curtin opens. Murdoch started in 1990 and then Notre Dame (1997) and then Edith Cowan. All of the others will be running law at undergraduate level. It will be interesting to see how the competition pans out. They accept lower ATAR scores than UWA. 11:56 There has been a great change in supply and demand for lawyers over the years. In 1977, UWA was the only law school and operated a quota system of 110 so as not to over supply graduates for the legal profession. 90% of graduates used to get admitted to practice. 13:47 When it was found that UWA graduates were getting job, the quota expanded. In the 1990s, there was actually a shortage of lawyers. 14:36 The situation has now turned around. Once Curtin comes online there could be 800 graduates and there will not be jobs for them all. Competition for jobs is very fierce. Articles are dropping away as they cannot all get positions. 16:06 Luckily a law degree can give you a good grounding. Graduates can become diplomats or join a corporation as an in-house lawyer, work as a journalist or an administrator, etc. etc. 16:52 Track 7 00:00 Full Professor since 2004. Used to only have 3 professors. Had a spell as higher degrees coordinator from 2001-2007. 01:11 Study leave in 2008. Gave up teaching Legal Process. Became Deputy Dean around 2005 or 2006. Bill Ford was the Dean, Richard Bartlett was Deputy Dean but then went part time. 02:35 From 2007 Bill Ford asked PRH to work on curriculum changes to move towards the JD degree. Peter Creighton had been responsible for this but it was not implemented when UWA began to move in the same sort of direction. 04:10 In 2007 or 2008 Peter Creighton left and PRH was asked to take over the implementation of the new course. The fact that he was Deputy Dean dovetailed into this new role. A Committee was appointed to assist PRH about 2 years ago and they are now in the final stages of finalising the new curriculum with the introduction of the Juris Doctor in 2013. 05:35 PRH then also became Associate Dean of Teaching and Learning. This role deals with curriculum issues generally, student problems and exams. Every faculty has to have a number of people that mirror the way that the university is structured. Law is one of the smallest faculties, so has fewer people to do the jobs but still has to provide staff to do them. 06:41 In addition to the Associate Dean of Students there is an Associate Dean of Teaching and Learning. It is expected that the Associate Dean of Teaching and Learning sits on the University Committee and becomes part of that structure. 07:03 There is also an Associate Dean of Research who spearheads research at the Law School and also sits on the university committee. 07:21 The higher degrees coordinator deals with students doing PhDs and other research degrees. Similarly they also sit on the university higher degrees committee. 07:48 This new system is partially a response to the increasing number of students and partially because of the university’s new and more elaborate administrative structure. 08:15 PRH handed Associate Dean of Teaching and Learning to Mark Israel who was appointed a Professor at the UWA Law School in 2010 but maintained responsibility for curriculum reform. 09:02 In 2012 new undergraduate units were introduced. Law & Society was taught as part of the BA and Business Law as part of the BComm. 09:28 All the curriculum development including Masters degrees were part of PJH’s responsibility until this year (2012). 10:02 PRH has indicated that from 2013 he will be going to factional teaching 0.4. The new Dean from 2011 was Stuart Kaye and PRH was Deputy Dean for the first year or so. Stuart has a different sort of person in mind for Deputy Dean in the hope that the functions previously carried out by the Dean, will now become the role of the Sub Dean (such as organisational teaching which PRH did). The Deputy Dean will be a much more full-time position and consequently only a half time teaching load. 11:10 In September 2012, PRH will no longer be Deputy Dean and will then go to part-time teaching – about 3 hours a week. 11:39 Track 7 Deans at the UWA Law School The official list on the plaque includes two periods when there was an Acting Dean 00:00 1928-1963 Frank Beasley 1964 Eric Edwards 1964-1970 Douglas Payne 1971-1975 Eric Edwards 1975-1976 Ian McCall 1976-1978 Eric Edwards 1979-1981 Anthony Dickey 1982-1983 Richard Harding 1984-1986 Louis Proksch 1987-1989 Jim O’Donovan 1990-1992 Stan Hotop 1993-1995 John Phillips 1996-2000 Ian Campbell 2001-2011 Bill Ford 2011- Stuart Kaye 01:56 Track 8 00:00 00:23 Conclusion Audio Files Links to audio files <a href="http://oralhistories.arts.uwa.edu.au/files/original/b24ce0fccb88b566197b1fc206b3d3de.mp3">Handford, Interview 1, Track 1</a> <br /><a href="http://oralhistories.arts.uwa.edu.au/files/original/f4cfb3ed1670e0cbf4ff3c0542faec83.mp3">Handford, Interview 1, Track 2</a> <br /><a href="http://oralhistories.arts.uwa.edu.au/files/original/f208ac563f4b5db09f5284336dff7822.mp3">Handford, Interview 1, Track 3</a> <br /><a href="http://oralhistories.arts.uwa.edu.au/files/original/936a4559bc7f74379dc651f7c2a200f4.mp3">Handford, Interview 1, Track 4</a> <br /><a href="http://oralhistories.arts.uwa.edu.au/files/original/da218921781f96bbc059ec461cd03e4c.mp3">Handford, Interview 1, Track 5</a> <br /><a href="http://oralhistories.arts.uwa.edu.au/files/original/76726ea6de64c1c7b27a3be0be712324.mp3">Handford, Interview 1, Track 6</a> <br /><a href="http://oralhistories.arts.uwa.edu.au/files/original/77edef9f41a736bc74f6c793f6b86cd0.mp3">Handford, Interview 1, Track 7</a> <br /><a href="http://oralhistories.arts.uwa.edu.au/files/original/28dfe8955bea9465c812cc5e37fc9593.mp3">Handford, Interview 2, Track 1</a> <br /><a href="http://oralhistories.arts.uwa.edu.au/files/original/dc2213d8412cfc322b7149dbd5ca57d7.mp3">Handford, Interview 2, Track 2</a> <br /><a href="http://oralhistories.arts.uwa.edu.au/files/original/aec0d70dea9897a68a72931fe06381cf.mp3">Handford, Interview 2, Track 3</a> <br /><a href="http://oralhistories.arts.uwa.edu.au/files/original/9f1239b86030d3ef2895eaec3eb143bb.mp3">Handford, Interview 2, Track 4</a> <br /><a href="http://oralhistories.arts.uwa.edu.au/files/original/caf4a3bcc8c4610821d196061f2828f6.mp3">Handford, Interview 2, Track 5</a> <br /><a href="http://oralhistories.arts.uwa.edu.au/files/original/5f2ff67df40f99ffbf18d4ba7057d0c6.mp3">Handford, Interview 2, Track 6</a> <br /><a href="http://oralhistories.arts.uwa.edu.au/files/original/b1f63b687ce751987649209c39b06170.mp3">Handford, Interview 2, Track 7</a> <br /><a href="http://oralhistories.arts.uwa.edu.au/files/original/5fa6b17cf4bb691019258b8a6fbfd866.mp3">Handford, Interview 2, Track 8</a> <br /><a href="http://oralhistories.arts.uwa.edu.au/files/original/014aeaa16dc138d90c99c06afbf6b186.mp3">Handford, Interview 2, Track 9</a> Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Peter Handford interview, 6 December 2012 and 13 December 2012 Subject The topic of the resource Law Description An account of the resource This is an interview with Winthrop Professor Peter Handford. After education at Birmingham and Cambridge, and a teaching appointment at the University of Leicester, Peter Handford joined the University of Western Australia in 1977. Between 1983 and 1998 he worked for the W.A. Law Reform Commission while retaining a part-time position at UWA. In 1998 he returned to the UWA Law School where he has held various positions, including Sub-Dean, Deputy Dean, and Associate Dean for Teaching and Learning. He has been heavily involved in curriculum reform in the Law School, culminating in the introduction of the Juris Doctor degree in 2013. Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Handford, Peter Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available University of Western Australia Historical Society Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource Copyright holder University of Western Australia Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource MP3 files Type The nature or genre of the resource Oral History Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource UWA ORAL HISTORIES Description An account of the resource A collection of interviews with former UWA staff, recorded by the <a href="http://www.alumni.uwa.edu.au/community/historical-society" target="_blank">UWA Historical Society</a> to mark the Centenary of the University in 2013. <br />The UWA Historical Society’s <a href="http://www.alumni.uwa.edu.au/community/historical-society/oral-histories" target="_blank">Oral History Program</a> started as a project with four oral histories funded from Society resources. It was then expanded with support from every Faculty on campus, the Guild, Convocation and through private donations. Additional funding was received through a Heritage Grant. Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available University of Western Australia Historical Society Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource University of Western Australia Historical Society Oral History A resource containing historical information obtained in interviews with persons having firsthand knowledge. Interviewer The person(s) performing the interview Julia Wallis Interviewee The person(s) being interviewed Richard Harding Location The location of the interview Claremont, WA Duration Length of time involved (seconds, minutes, hours, days, class periods, etc.) Interview 1: 1 hour, 7 minutes, 13 seconds Interview 2: 1 hour, 19 minutes, 1 second Total: 2 hours, 26 minutes, 14 seconds Bit Rate/Frequency Rate at which bits are transferred (i.e. 96 kbit/s would be FM quality audio) 128 kbs Time Summary A summary of an interview given for different time stamps throughout the interview Interview 1 00:00:00 Introduction by Julia Wallis 00:00:40 00:00:52 Richard Harding was born in the Bristol area just before World War Two. He studied law at University College London and obtained a scholarship to Columbia University in New York where he obtained a Masters’ degree. Invited to become an Assistant Lecturer at University College London where he taught for nearly 4 years. Invited to apply to UWA Law School by Douglas Payne, the then Dean of the Law School. Richard arrived in Western Australia on 3 February 1965. 00:05:05 The university put him up at the Captain Stirling Hotel for a couple of weeks before he moved to a flat in South Perth. UWA had been in the news in the UK due through the Benn murder case in 1964. Richard’s contract was for 2 years but soon had no thoughts of returning to the UK because the university provided a supportive, friendly and collegial environment. He got to know a wide cross section of people across the whole university both professional and non-professional. Within days of his arrival, he was sampling the delights of the Festival of Perth. At that time, the UWA Law School was highly regarded by the judiciary and the profession – much more so than had been the case in London. 00:10:39 Richard was teaching Conflict of Law within 3 weeks of his arrival. This subject had a very strong Australian Constitutional law overlay. Richard put together the student Case Book which was the 600-700 page textbook for the course. He realised Australian law was different to English law. 00:15:13 A week after his arrival, the Law Summer School was held. Many luminaries in the profession attended such as Sir John Kerr, Sir Zelman Cowan and Sir Geoffrey Saw. This made Richard feel that he was in touch with what was going on both in WA and further afield. Within 6 months of his arrival, he attended a very important Commonwealth Law conference in Sydney and met the criminologist Gordon Hawkins who sparked his interest in this field. The Law School was located in dongas behind Geography. At that time the Law School only had 7 full-time teachers and relied on part time visiting teachers from the professional including Sir Francis Burt, John Toohey and Sir Ronald Wilson. Douglas Payne wanted to professionalise the teaching staff but did not want to marginalise the legal profession from the Law School. 00:24:00 Professor Douglas Payne persuaded the university to commit to a new building and moved into the new Law School, designed by Gus Ferguson, in about 1967 or 1968. The old premises could not cope with the increase in the student body and teaching staff. The main university campus was concentrated around Winthrop Hall. University House was located near the present Octagon Theatre. Everyone went here to socialise. Richard was secretary of University House in the late 1960s. He was also secretary of the Staff Association. In about 1972 he was elected as a staff representative to the Senate and was a non-professorial representative on the Professorial Board. He was deeply involved in university life. 00:28:27 Each Faculty controlled some research funding. Richard was granted some money from the Law School in about 1967 to research the use of lethal force by police. This led him down the path of further studies into human rights, criminal law and human justice issues. Richard was living in a university house in Myers Street, Nedlands in 1966 when a policeman shot a young man dead nearby. Penguin published his book, Police Killings in Australia, in 1970. It caused some controversy. Richard continued to study this aspect of the law for the next 5 years. In 1971, he researched the use of police lethal force while on study leave at the University of Chicago and did a similar study with students in Toronto. Later, he studied fire arms in the Australian community and the events at Port Arthur in 1996. 00:33:43 The University trusted the heads of department to use seed money wisely. Richard doesn’t think he would have had access to this sort of funding in the UK. Richard suffered some personal attacks from certain people in the police force but he was supported by his friends in academia. Richard was not teaching criminal law at this stage. He taught industrial or labour law. This was a new course. The future Attorney-General of Western Australia, Joe Berinson, was one of his pupils. In the early years, Richard was younger than many of his students. The Law School attempted to keep up with changes in society with these new courses. 00:40:14 Richard was very close to his first groups of students. He had a holiday on Rottnest with his future wife and some students. He still attends the annual reunion of the first class he taught. Three female students out of a class of 26 graduated in his first year. Law is now female-dominated. Richard was part of the Arts Discussion Group (a dining club) at University House. Dining club members included the librarian, Leonard Jolley, a mathematician, a geographer, a geologist, a psychologist, a historian, people from the English department and occasionally a scientist. The group met monthly for an evening meal. Richard lectured in the Arts Department. The Staff Association was active. Later the Credit Union was set up. Management were involved with the life of the university. 00:45:38 Richard played squash with university people at Kings Park Squash Club. Richard’s social life changed after he was married to Alison and had children. The married staff set up a University Babysitting Club where time was traded for a babysitter but no money changed hands. 00:49:08 Several people at the Law School came from the UK. Richard recruited a former student from London to teach contract law. He also interviewed Anthony Dickey on behalf of the Dean. The staff made the system work for them. Today it is a different world. Other faculties did similar things. It was a pragmatic way to deal with the problems of a developing university but the top positions were open to a genuine contest. 00:55:30 Richard came on a two year contract but felt comfortable in Perth and soon found that there were opportunities here. After he met his future wife, it became clear that he was going to stay in Perth. The study leave or sabbatical leave arrangements were important to him. Sabbatical leave was not so readily available in the UK. In 1970, he went to Bristol University and then to Chicago. By now, he was launched on a public career path. He was elected on to the Law Reform Commission of WA in 1962 or 1963 working with David Malcolm who later became Chief Justice. In 1975, he was involved with the Australian Law Reform Commission. Justice Michael Kirby was Chair. Later that year, he went onto the board of the Australian Broadcasting Commission. It suited his interest in public administration. 00:59:36 Eric Edwards, the Dean of the Law School, asked Richard to put together a public lecture series to celebrate the 50th anniversary of the founding of the UWA Law School in 1977 . Invited speakers included John Toohey, Billy Snedden and Bob Hawke. Sir Lawrence Jackson, the Chief Justice and then Chancellor of the University supported the celebrations. The Law School had changed - there were more staff and students but the teaching method was still lectures and tutorials. The criminal law book produced as a text by Eric Edwards was used around Australia in the “Code” States, i.e. Queensland, Tasmania and WA (as opposed to the common law States of Victoria, New South Wales and South Australia). Mining law was being taught by about the mid-1970s. 01:04:21 Murdoch Law School was opened in the about 1975. It was mooted as to whether UWA wished to have a presence in the southern suburbs but it was agreed that a separate institution should be set up. 01:07:13 END OF INTERVIEW 1 Interview 2 00:00:00 Introduction by Julia Wallis 00:00:45 Richard was made a full Professor in 1981. He had developed new courses at UWA and applied for the position of Associate Professor in 1973 based on his research and publications and was successful. He had built a profile inside and outside of UWA. In 1979 he published Outside Interference: The Politics of Australian Broadcasting. By this time he was involved in policy relating to gun control and use. He led a research project on gun ownership in WA funded by monies from the UWA Law Faculty. Then he applied for a national grant from the Criminology Research Council and did a national survey on gun ownership. Senator Lionel Murphy the Attorney-General was very supportive. This led to the publication by UWA Press in 1981 of his book entitled Firearms and Violence in Australian Life: An Examination of Gun Ownership and Use in Australia. It was a pivotal book on this topic. In 1981, Richard convened the first national fire arms conference that took place at UWA, the Australian Institute of Criminology in Canberra and the Sydney Institute of Criminology. 00:08:06 Some on the Senate felt he was not closely enough in contact with the legal profession but he had support in other areas. At that time, he believes he was one of two professors at the Law School. He taught some criminology and the law school was slowly moving to encompass subjects hitherto not considered part and parcel of a law degree. 00:11:59 Anthony Dickey was Dean from 1979 to 1981. He was a good administrator and people person. Richard became Dean in 1982 and worked with the legal profession to acquire grants for visiting scholars, lecture series and prizes. An entrepreneur who was going to fund the Chair in Mining Law was unfortunately arrested before this was made official. Mining law is now a speciality of the UWA Law School. 00:15:13 In 1983, there was a Federal election and Bob Hawke became Prime Minister. The founding director of the Australian Institute of Criminology had resigned and the new government opened up the applications again. Richard applied for this position and was accepted. His application was bolstered by the fact that he had recently presented the John Barry Memorial Lecture in Melbourne on gun control. He resigned from the Dean’s position after only two years in the job. He took unpaid leave from UWA. The new job was interesting and stimulating and opened many doors plus he became deeply involved with the United Nations. Unfortunately his family didn’t settle in Canberra and he returned to teaching at UWA in 1988. 00:20:58 When he returned to UWA, he negotiated with the State Attorney-General and the Premier to set up a crime research centre to organise all the data from the different government agencies and to be able to examine whether public policy was working. They received a capital grant from the State and set up at UWA to produce meaningful crime statistics. Using the data they could do also pursue specific research projects such as Aboriginal contact with the criminal justice system. The Crime Research Centre started work in early 1988 and ceased to operate 26 years later in late 2014. It was a successful and enjoyable centre and Richard remained head until 2000. 00:26:56 Richard had also retained his international links. In the 1980s, he did some consultancy work with the United Nations on criminal justice policy. In 1985, he attended the Seventh UN Congress relating to crime prevention and control in Milan. He was involved with two important conventions one being the Beijing rules on the Administration of Juvenile Justice and the Charter of Victims’ Rights. Richard was able to bring some of this experience into his teaching at the Law School and to bring visiting people to the Law School. He helped to develop a unit in Corporate Crime as part of the LLM (Master of Laws). By now, second degrees fine tuning professional skills were desirable and necessary. Later a Masters of Criminal Justice was developed in the Law School comprising 14 units. 00:31:11 Universities started to realise the benefits of being known for their research. Up until now, the UWA Law School had not really understood the importance of research. The Crime Research was doing the bulk of the research. The Centre forged ties with Mathematics and Computing and developed a computerised system to analyse data. A huge safe was purchased to store the data tapes. The Australian Bureau of Statistics was not at first much interested in crime statistics. This has since changed. At that time there was no overall picture of criminal behaviour across Australia. The Crime Research Centre at UWA took a couple of years to organise the criminal stats from WA. Then they began to do crime mapping. They published an analysis of road rage in a Swedish journal long before it got talked about. 00:44:56 The Centre employed many different experts to analyse the data. Data was also analysed to research domestic violence. Some of the law students used the Centre for their PhD studies. In hindsight, they should have had more of these. The Centre also taught a course in the Arts department that was very successful. Alcohol and drugs have been a factor in crime research for a long time. 00:49:06 When Richard left as director of the Crime Research Centre at UWA in 2000 a new director took over. Richard felt that their support base from the external agencies was not so strong after he left. The data collection dropped off a bit and the Centre’s relevance was diminished. UWA tightened up on all their research centres and attempted to control their autonomy and their funding. In Richard’s day, agreements were made with a handshake. From about 2000 onwards, UWA began to charge the research centres large fees. Good staff left for other opportunities. The Law School was going through its own changes and did not fully understand the value of a research centre. Earlier Deans had understood that the Centre was getting competitive ARC research grants and that the prestige would reflect on them as well. It was claimed that the Centre was bankrupt and it was terminated. Nowadays there is nobody organising the crime statistics for Western Australia - let alone collect and integrate them. 00:56:44 Richard became Inspector of Custodial Services in 2000 and served for 8 years. In 1997, he published Private Prisons and Public Accountability. He advised the State Government on private prisons. 01:02:41 Richard negotiated academic leave as part of his contract with Custodial Services in order to keep up with developments and do some teaching at UWA. He used his leave to work at Keele University and twice at Cambridge University. By now, he was an Emeritus Professor at UWA and teaching the criminal justice course which he taught every second year over an 11 year period. UWA is now in a corporate phase which reflects trends across Australia. 01:07:24 When he took on the job as Inspector of Custodial Services, Richard resigned from UWA but retained links with the university which meant that it was quite seamless for him to return. Richard prefers to teach in a traditional manner and see his students face-to-face. 01:09:28 In 2012, Richard went to the Free University of Amsterdam where the National Crime Research Institute is based. He became involved with the Association for the Prevention of Torture before he left Custodial Services in 2008. He did consultancy work in Britain with a group that was running private prisons; for the Australian Human Rights Commission and other Australian government groups. 01:14:45 Australia has tended to view the northern European countries and particularly Holland as being world leaders in area of prison rehabilitation. Universities can be the link in bringing innovative ideas to the attention of government. 01:19:01 END OF INTERVIEW 2 Audio Files Links to audio files <a href="http://oralhistories.arts.uwa.edu.au/files/original/fa36128612da935c90987b1996dab643.mp3">Harding, Interview, Track 1</a> <br /><a href="http://oralhistories.arts.uwa.edu.au/files/original/900a96d7c323ef301c17bf5dd9eed3e3.mp3">Harding, Interview, Track 2</a> <br /><a href="http://oralhistories.arts.uwa.edu.au/files/original/2752227262273a3a6673e0851976d56b.mp3">Harding, Interview, Track 3</a> Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Richard Harding interview, 1 April 2015 and 8 April 2015 Subject The topic of the resource Law Description An account of the resource Emeritus Professor Richard Harding came to the UWA Law School as a Senior Lecturer in 1965 from University College London. He was made Associate Professor in 1973, Professor in 1981 and was Dean of the Law School from 1982 to 1983. Richard became interested in criminal law and has researched and written widely in the areas of law, criminology and penology. He was appointed Director at the Australian Institute of Criminology in Canberra where he was based from 1984 to 1987. From 1988-2000 he founded and was the Director of the Crime Research Centre within the Law School at the University of WA. From 2000-2008 he was Inspector of Custodial Services for Western Australia. Since vacating this position, he has been extensively involved in academic and consultancy work. He is currently Emeritus Professor at the Law School of Western Australia and has been assisting the university to develop a more effective presence in the area of Law and Public Policy. Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Harding, Richard Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available University of Western Australia Historical Society Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource Copyright University of Western Australia Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource MP3 files Type The nature or genre of the resource Oral History Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource UWA ORAL HISTORIES Description An account of the resource A collection of interviews with former UWA staff, recorded by the <a href="http://www.alumni.uwa.edu.au/community/historical-society" target="_blank">UWA Historical Society</a> to mark the Centenary of the University in 2013. <br />The UWA Historical Society’s <a href="http://www.alumni.uwa.edu.au/community/historical-society/oral-histories" target="_blank">Oral History Program</a> started as a project with four oral histories funded from Society resources. It was then expanded with support from every Faculty on campus, the Guild, Convocation and through private donations. Additional funding was received through a Heritage Grant. Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available University of Western Australia Historical Society Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource University of Western Australia Historical Society Oral History A resource containing historical information obtained in interviews with persons having firsthand knowledge. Interviewer The person(s) performing the interview Julia Wallis Interviewee The person(s) being interviewed Bob Hetherington Location The location of the interview Highgate, W.A. Duration Length of time involved (seconds, minutes, hours, days, class periods, etc.) 44 minutes, 53 seconds Bit Rate/Frequency Rate at which bits are transferred (i.e. 96 kbit/s would be FM quality audio) 128 kbs Time Summary A summary of an interview given for different time stamps throughout the interview Track 1 00:00 Introduction by Julia Wallis 00:30 Track 2 00:00 Robert Hetherington. Born 8 January 1923 at Mount Gambier in South Australia. 00:15 6 July 1951 married Penelope Loveday. They had twin boys and a girl. 00:29 1951 – graduated from the University of Adelaide with a Bachelor of Arts with 2nd class Honours degree in History and Political Science. 00:45 1951 – employed by the Commonwealth Public Service 00:51 1952 – research scholar at the University of Adelaide 00:56 1953-1956 – History master at Kings College, Kensington Park, South Australia. A Baptist Congregationalist School 01:26 1957-1966 – Tutor and senior tutor in Politics at the University of Adelaide. The Acting Head of the Politics Department was Leo Blair. His son Tony was 4 years old at the time. Met Leo at a party and he asked Bob if he would like to tutor in the Politics Department and he agreed. 02:10 The students were taught about John Locke, Mill (John Stuart) and the Westminster system of government. Bob brought these ideas with him when he came to WA. 03:04 May 1977 – Lecturer in Politics at UWA 03:14 The first professor of politics at UWA was Gordon Reid. He used to be sergeant at arms at Parliament House in Canberra. He was recruited by Professor Duncan, the professor of politics at Adelaide University as Reader in Politics. When the Professor of History and Politics at UWA resigned, he applied for the position and got it. 04:25 Bob Hetherington was employed as the first course controller for the politics course at UWA. He also taught Australian Politics and Democratic Thought. 05:07 Before this the History Department ran a second year course in political science taught by E D (Ted) Watt who came across to the Politics Department. He taught the second year course. 05:36 When Bob taught politics he would not reveal his own personal background and politics leanings until the second half of the year to prove to the students that he could be impartial. 06:31 Bob developed a whole lecture on the fact that the State makes you the way you are. When he finished the lecture, he told the students that if they believe that, they were fascists! 06:59 Communism was on the wane at this stage. It was more popular when Bob was a student. Bob regarded both the Catholic Church and the Communist party of exercising intellectual tyranny over their adherents. 07:37 When Bob was tutoring in South Australia it was not long after the Second World War and he had many middle aged students. He learnt a lot from them. He put forward an idea one day to have it denounced as “nonsense”. 08:16 One day he totally opposed everything a student was telling him. The student argued that he had told the class this the other day. Bob informed him that since then he had changed his mind due to having a discussion with one of his students. He enjoyed having students that argued with him. 08:48 He used to tell his students not to sit at his feet and expect to be told truths. They were there to argue and debate. 09:16 Later on, Bob tutored at Murdoch. In his class was the son of the professor of Classics at UWA. He was very disappointed when they were not able to get Bob back the next year to teach as he was “the first person who made him think”. 10:20 The University of Adelaide was land locked and tightly contained whereas Perth had a beautiful campus. 10:58 When the Hetheringtons arrived in Perth they were accommodated at a university house on the campus. Eventually they bought a house in Claremont. They had a car and Bob drove to Uni. 12:15 The Politics Department was located in the Arts Building. Later on they were moved to the Social Science Building. This was probably due to a lack of space. They were quite close to the History Department in many respects (not just proximity). Brian de Garis was in the History department at this time. When Fred Alexander retired the Chair of History was split in two and Bert Hallam and Geoffrey Bolton appointed. 14:33 The History and Politics departments were closer in Adelaide as they shared a tea room and knew each other very well. They were no crossover lectures between the history and politics departments at UWA. 14:56 When Bob arrived the staff included Professor Gordon Reid (3rd year course in public administration); Ted Watt (2nd year course) and Bob. He was expected to have 70 students and do all the lecturing and tutoring. However, it was during the Vietnam War and he ended up with 182 students. 16:05 Bob thinks that there was protest on campus but cannot remember anything specific. 16:34 He could not do the tutoring on his own and asked Geoff Bolton for help. He sent along Barbara Hamilton who stayed for year and eventually became a lecturer. Later Sandra Penrose came and tutored. Both ladies eventually demanded that they be allowed to do some of the lecturing. 17:33 This changed the course a little bit. The crux of the course was the Westminster system; the Australian political system and. Students also studied a book by Walter Bagehot, the Australian constitution and the party system. Democratic thought covered the writings of John Locke, John Stuart Mill and other writers who believed in democracy. 18:24 Bob’s former professor in Adelaide, Professor Duncan, said it was the best course he had seen. Bruce Stone was until recently the Head of the Politics Department and would be able to supply further information on courses. He was formerly a student of Bob’s and very bright. 18:57 Many students went on to get a job in Foreign Affairs. Some became academics. Other did it before they did a law degree. 19:41 Marika Vicziany was another very bright student who went to London as is now a professor of Asian Political Economy at Monash University, Melbourne. 20:24 Bob was a notoriously hard marker and failed a third of his students. The assessment was by essays and examination. 20:49 The students would choose an essay topic and would have to research and write a paper. They were able to argue points in their essays. One student wrote a brilliant essay on the American Constitution. He argued that it existed to keep to bourgeoisie in power. 21:41 One student was not doing so well. Bob told him that he had reached rock bottom and could only go up from that point and he did! 22:22 Many students found the transition from school to university very challenging. The men wrote scrabbly stuff – the writing and the English was bad. The girls wrote in beautiful round handwriting but the work wasn’t very good. An ex student of Bob’s in Adelaide was Anne Cooper (now Anne Summers. Bob told her that her first essay contained better polemics than analysis. 23:53 There were more middle class women and ex-service people in his classes than was the case at UWA in Perth. 24:31 Track 3 00:00 At one stage Bob lectured at the Octagon as it could hold 300 students. Others did not enjoy lecturing here. He used a table instead of the rostrum. He handed out summaries of the lecture and ad-libbed from his summary. There was no technology in these days – just word of mouth. 01:30 Ralph Pervan was also in the Politics Department and regarded as a “reasonable person”. After the Whitlam Dismissal in 1975, a rally was held in the Entertainment Centre. 6,500 people attended and Bob was told to warm up the crowd. He addressed them as “Fellow Democrats”. Ralph Pervan commented later that this was more like the Nuremburg Rally 02:49 There was flexibility to incorporate current affairs into the political lectures. 03:38 Bob said that he learnt a lot from lecturing. The students appreciated him getting out from behind the table to meet the audience. 04:05 There would be about 10 in a tutorial. They liked to keep the numbers small in order to relate to the students. Bob was a good tutor and engaged with the students. They would have to discuss a topic. 06:03 The male/female ratio at UWA was just about 50/50. Mature aged women started to attend in the Whitlam era. 06:45 Ted Watt was very helpful when Bob cased the joint in 1966 and drove him around Perth as a pillion passenger on his motor bike. At this time, they were tearing down the Barracks. It was suggested that a bridge should link the Barracks and Parliament House. This is being canvassed again for the upcoming State Election in 2013. 08:08 The students did not visit Parliament House as part of the politics course. When Bob was a member of parliament he would show students around. 08:34 One of Bob’s first speeches in Parliament attacked Charles Court. Bob left UWA to enter politics. Bob was beaten for preselection by Fred Chaney and Bob McMullan talked him into going into the Legislative Council. A new two member seat was established and he was the member with Fred McKenzie. 11:27 Bob’s academic background was not a great help in his political career. 12:00 Brian McKinnon was the Leader of the House. One day Bob had not had time to distribute notes to accompany his speech. Bob argued that this was not mandatory. Mr McKinnon argued that the notes might make the speech understandable. Bob said he did not expect to make the leader any wiser but he was trying to inform him! 14:06 Bob was not aware of internal university politics. Gordon Reid ran the department without any outside interference. 15:06 The department did not mix socially outside work. Bob would visit Gordon from time to time. Gordon was very proper. They would visit Ted Watt and his wife. Ted was a right wing devout Catholic. 16:14 Morning and afternoon tea was taken in the department. Lunches could be eaten and/or bought outside the department. 16:42 Pat Carruthers was the department secretary. She was devoted to Professor Reid. Her husband converted part of the pantry in Claremont into a toilet. Bob wrote an article about Gordon. He has since misplaced this. Gordon was an ex navigator in a bomber during WW2. Ruth was a war bride that be brought back from England. Bob was in the army for 4 years and 6 months. Both had a military background. 18:58 Some people wore gowns but Bob just wore a smart shirt and trousers. Some students thought Bob was a Liberal because he often wore a blue shirt. The students wore what they liked. 20:22 Track 4 00:00 00:11 Conclusion Audio Files Links to audio files <a href="http://oralhistories.arts.uwa.edu.au/files/original/5361f2148dc551f6e16a06424584fea5.mp3">Hetherington, Interview 1, Track 1</a> <br /><a href="http://oralhistories.arts.uwa.edu.au/files/original/eda431c6940651a9af8b47d5dd43a716.mp3">Hetherington, Interview 1, Track 2</a> <br /><a href="http://oralhistories.arts.uwa.edu.au/files/original/79968969f9bd2f940c629652fa13957a.mp3">Hetherington, Interview 1, Track 3</a> <br /><a href="http://oralhistories.arts.uwa.edu.au/files/original/400faad50d737b53e23ed8904002112c.mp3">Hetherington, Interview 1, Track 4</a> Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Bob Hetherington interview, 24 January 2013 Subject The topic of the resource Political science Description An account of the resource Bob Hetherington joined UWA in 1966 from Adelaide University. He established the first year course in the Politics Department. He was a Labor member of the Western Australian Legislative Council from 1977 to 1989. In 1987 he introduced a private member's bill into the council to legalise homosexuality, which was narrowly defeated. Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Hetherington, Bob Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available University of Western Australia Historical Society Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource Copyright holder University of Western Australia Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource MP3 files Type The nature or genre of the resource Oral History Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource UWA ORAL HISTORIES Description An account of the resource A collection of interviews with former UWA staff, recorded by the <a href="http://www.alumni.uwa.edu.au/community/historical-society" target="_blank">UWA Historical Society</a> to mark the Centenary of the University in 2013. <br />The UWA Historical Society’s <a href="http://www.alumni.uwa.edu.au/community/historical-society/oral-histories" target="_blank">Oral History Program</a> started as a project with four oral histories funded from Society resources. It was then expanded with support from every Faculty on campus, the Guild, Convocation and through private donations. Additional funding was received through a Heritage Grant. Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available University of Western Australia Historical Society Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource University of Western Australia Historical Society Oral History A resource containing historical information obtained in interviews with persons having firsthand knowledge. Interviewer The person(s) performing the interview Anne Yardley Interviewee The person(s) being interviewed Maria Rie Heymans Location The location of the interview Jolimont, WA Duration Length of time involved (seconds, minutes, hours, days, class periods, etc.) Interview 1: 1 hour, 11 minutes Interview 2: 58 minutes Total: 2 hours, 9 minutes Bit Rate/Frequency Rate at which bits are transferred (i.e. 96 kbit/s would be FM quality audio) 128 kbs Time Summary A summary of an interview given for different time stamps throughout the interview Interview 1 0:00 Introduction by Anne Yardley 00:30 Rie was born in The Hague, Netherlands in 1932 and has one sister. She grew up during the difficult war years: despite being hungry all the time , the girls sometimes found excitment with no school and the freedom to wander the streets for days on end, playing and salvaging wood for fires. Often cooked potato peelings formed the evening meal, it was especially difficult for her mother. Rie believes the experience toughened her up for later life: “I can’t really explain it—it made me vehemently anti-war—always have been. I was marching against the Vietnam War…. I didn’t want other kids to go through that because it was terrifying.” 04:25 Rie has little recollection of returning to school post war but does remember it felt strange. At high school she loved languages and history and wanted to become a lawyer. Rie’s father didn’t believe in education for girls and she had to work very hard just to be allowed to finish school. As a child of divorced parents, she was discriminated against when applying for jobs, despite having excellent school results. She did eventually take an office job: “it wasn’t what I wanted to do, it was just a job.” 09:15 Rie met her future husband David through friendship with his sister in the Girl Guides, which she disliked: “I hated camping with a passion.” He lived in New Guinea for two years and on his return they decided to marry and migrate. Quotas were full for the United States and Canada: “because everyone wanted to leave. Europe was in ruins.” In 1953, they chose Queensland but Rie’s severe onboard sickness convinced them to leave the ship at Fremantle. In hindsight, Rie believes her sickness was due to stress. She was frightened of the move. Fortunately, the WA coastline from Gages Road looked inviting. 14:15 Through a Dutch clergyman on the wharf, they found unappealing accommodation in Beaconsfield: crowded and very basic. Rie describes their first days in Perth and job hunting. They found work in at the Walpole guest house. The landscape, recently burnt, was “ghastly”. The work was tough, long hours and hard work. David was clearing land and milking cows. 18:30 On early feelings about moving to Perth: “I wish I never had, I was lonely, people were unpleasant and rude. Australians didn’t welcome migrants in the 1950s.” David studied interior design at TAFE and met David Foulkes Taylor and was invited to work with him. With no galleries in Perth at that time, David Foulkes Taylor showed artists, such as Robert Juniper and Guy Grey Smith, in his showroom. Rie and David met local artists where they were welcomed. 21:40 Introduction to this community was very important for Rie’s future career: they developed an interest and knowledge in art. Rie visited New York at the invitation of friends. She visited galleries and went to the theatre: “my eyes were out on stalks.” She found work at the Australian Consulate and studied the history of art at the Pratt Institute of Fine Art in Brooklyn. She would like to have stayed but David didn’t want to move. 25:15 Rie was terrified about running an art gallery, but David pursued the idea and rented the Old Fire Station in McCourt, Leederville to start an art gallery [which ran from 1968 to 1976]. They borrowed money and did most of the work themselves: “It was very brazen but we had the support of many, many artists…it took off and went very well.” 29:15 Rose Skinner, at the Skinner Galleries , showed mostly well known, established artists like Sidney Nolan. Apart from Cremorne Gallery in Hay Street, no one else showed local artists. Rie and David chose to show young local artists most of whom had not previously exhibited and who stayed loyal to the gallery: “It was exciting ... no money in it, but that didn’t seem to matter as long as we could make ends meet.” 30:50 There were no other galleries in the late 1960s but much later there was a flourish of galleries. Most closed their doors with the GFC [Global Financial Crisis 2007-2008]. Rie learnt to run a gallery “by trail and error” and the use of common sense. 31: 55 “It’s the selection of artists that’s important … if the work appealed to me, even if I didn’t think it was saleable, but I felt it was good work, I would show it.” Some shows therefore barely made a profit, the more popular ones balanced things out. Miriam Stannage, for example was difficult to sell then. Now Chris Capper sells now for $3,500 - $4,000 Rie battled to sell his work for $250 or $300. The artists she has shown have all done well. [Rie believed it was important to support local artists and amongst those were many women like Miriam Stannage, Nola Farman. Carol Rudyard, Elise Blumann, Portia Bennett, Marie Hobbs, Helen Grey-Smith ,Helen Taylor, Mary Dudin and others]. 34:00 Prices were determined in consultation with the artist, Rie taking 25 per cent commission, all the costs were the gallery’s. Now galleries charge 40 to 50 per cent with artists paying costs. Rie did all the work herself: climbing ladders to hang paintings, writing media releases, developing and executing marketing ideas. [You have to unpack works, carry them and put them on the walls. When you are by yourself, as I was in the Old Fire Station it is hard work. You are up and down ladders, adjusting lights and hanging paintings. You need to be good with an electric drill and screwdriver etc. When you have a ceramics or a sculpture show you lug those around. It is not easy. Setting up a show is very physically demanding.] 37:50 Rie chose work based on her personal preferences, sale-ability came second. She found that people without art knowledge are often attracted to showy work of little merit: “Rubbish sells readily”. 40:00 Rie discusses the challenges of running an art gallery: “Keeping your head above water” is number one; the work is physically difficult; being tough enough to let people down gently when their work is not good enough. During the nickel boom people spent money on art. Rie didn’t sell art for investment, her advice to buyers was to buy work they wanted to live with and if it increased in value, all the better. 45:15 “To stick it in a vault because you bought it as an investment, that’s not buying art.” The relationship with her clients was important: offering them good pictures and her advice. Competition between galleries was very competitive. 48:45 Relationships with the artists was “fantastic and they’re still my friends, still.” On her retirement from UWA a breakfast was organised with artists presenting a piece of work to her for the occasion. She was given over 140 pieces of art. 50:40 Art training was good then as artists taught students. For example, Guy Grey Smith taught at Curtin, Robert Juniper taught at Guildford Grammar School and they passed on their knowledge. Most artists needed to teach to earn a living. 52:00 Rie gave up the Old Fire Station Gallery when the mining boom collapsed and her marriage ended. She made a late application for the position of curator at UWA and was offered the job after appearing before the University Art Collection Board of Management which included David Lawe Davies, Headmaster Guildford Grammar School as Chairman. Rie was successful she says because she was a hard worker and used her imagination to promote artists and the gallery. Importantly she was a board member of the Visual Arts Board of the Australia Council and had run a successful private art gallery over many years. With the Australia Council, Rie travelled around Australia meeting artists and gallery owners at public hearings to determine how best to run a successful arts program. The Whitlam years were exciting for the visual arts, theatre, dance. 55:50 Rie was introduced to interstate artists through this work and she exchanged artists with, for instance, Watters Gallery in Sydney. At UWA, Rie showed Fred Williams, Sidney Nolan, Charles Blackman, among others, at the Undercroft. Rie describes these and other shows at the Undercroft as very exciting. 57:00 Rie’s brief as Curator of Pictures was to look after the university’s collection; establish an exhibition program over 12 months and purchase new works of art. Purchases had to be within the modest annual budget which, while augmented by bequests from the John Collins bequest and others, was still small. Rie travelled interstate to view collections. She describes the collection she inherited: a strong core of Antipodean artists—Sidney Nolan, Arthur Boyd, John Percival, Charles Blackman. Rie discusses works by Nolan in the collection. 59:00 Local artists included Guy Grey Smith, Robert Juniper, Geoffrey Allen plus graphics and silk screens from European artists that “didn’t make sense.” Others had been bought from the Skinner Galleries and Rie’s gallery. The collection lacked cohesion and Rie attempted to fill the gaps. For instance: “Women had been completely ignored.” Rie believes she did reasonably well on a small budget. Women artists were still cheap to acquire then. 1:02:36 Acquiring the works Rie wanted meant scouring catalogues and staying in contact with galleries Australia wide. One interesting group came from Europe in the 1930s escaping Nazism: “they were damn good painters and they hadn’t been collected,” because they weren’t painting traditional Australian scenes. Rie had to present works she wished to acquire to a monthly board meeting: “it’s not easy to convince academics as a non-academic and a woman.” 1:07:00 By the end of her tenure, Rie was able to make themed exhibitions with the works she had acquired. The criteria was for Australian artists: to acquire historical works to fill the gaps and strengthen the contemporary collection. 1:08:00 The collection was housed all over campus. Annually a stocktake was done to check the condition of works, for instance, some had been hanging in the sun, some had disappeared. Staff could chose works to put on their walls. The Australia Council had a system for registering works which Rie adopted to ensure a solid record, she then rented a suitable warehouse to store the works in preparation for the new gallery [to replace the Undercroft previously used for exhibitions]. 1:10:55 Interview 2 00:00 Introduction by Anne Yardley 00:35 Rie discusses the European artists [mentioned in interview 1] and the contribution they made to Australian art : Yosl Bergner, a Jewish artist form Warsaw. Rie discusses her reasons for buying The Pie Eaters; and German artist Elise Blumann “a strong gutsy painter” Rie describes Summer Nude and On the Swan at Nedlands; Evening on the Yarra Claris Beckett,was gifted to the collection, “a beautiful picture.”. 05:20 Some Australian artists understood the European newcomers, for instance Melbourne artist, Noel Counihan: The Pumpkin Seller – painting what life was like for many in Melbourne; Harold Vike, a Norwegian socialist who lived in Perth, his work The Reading Room and People on a Tram. Rie says they are “a slice of life” and works depicting urban life are as important as bush scenes. 10:05 At times it was difficult and stressful convincing the board to collect these painters. The board included a student guild member nominated by students. Rie recalls Digby Cullen and John Carruthers. 13:00 Rie explains how she attracted donations. It was very competitive and hard work. She gave talks to various groups and was often invited to view people’s private collections. Tax deductibility encouraged donations. 17:30 Acquisitions most commonly came through purchases which meant going to every exhibition for local, contemporary artists. The works would be shown to the Board. Rie would notify all galleries in Australia of work she sought. 18:50 Rie was keen to collect women artists as there were few apart from Elizabeth Durack in the collection. She describes Adelaide Perry’s Woman Pilot, 1931, as another strong image: “Those sorts of women should be in a university collection. They are just as important as the male artists.” Rie discusses other women artists. 21:15 It was difficult for women artists to make a living, Rie believes it is still somewhat true today. Portia Bennett painted Perth city, on site, as it was in the 1940a: Hotel Adelphi, 1948, on St George’s Terrace. Her husband didn’t approve of her painting. 26:42 Rie hoped to encourage students and anyone interested in Australian art. She tried to get a thread running from early Australian artists through to today’s artists. Rie mentions Ian Fairweather’s works that were gifted to the collection by Rose Skinner. A Melbourne dealer, Joseph Brown, also made donations. 31:25 The Visual Arts Board made many important works available and provided money for purchases. There was more money available in the 1970s. On her success, Rie says she transferred her methods from the Old Fire Station to the university. Rie used her own imagination to get publicity for the gallery. For instance the 9 x 5 and Love a Duck promotions. 33:50 Rie discusses the “9 x 5” promotion in 1989: 100 years after the original 9 x 5 exhibition in Melbourne where artists produced an exhibition of work painted on cigar box lids. Rie used 3 ply cut to size and asked artists to paint pictures which were then sold for fund raising. Bob Gregson acted as auctioneer and every picture was sold. Rie describes the function and how it operated. 37:30 “Love a Duck” was an earlier promotion in 1987. Ducks were made by an artist from palm fronds, Rie asked artists to paint the ducks which were auctioned in a similar event which raised over $30,000. Artists who contributed included Ken Done, Robert Juniper, Leon Pericles. Artists entered into the spirit of the event, they were prepared to assist to get a better gallery for the university’s collection. Their contribution went towards the furnishings. 42:10 On the challenges of the Undercroft as a gallery: the screens had to be dismountable as the Undercroft was needed for exams, Save the Children Fund book sale and other events. Despite the challenges: “we managed to have some good exhibitions that I’m still proud of.” There’d be about 12 exhibitions per year. There was a further gallery space at the back of the Undercroft near Rie’s office, literally a broom cupboard. 44:05 On what gave Rie the greatest pride: her acquisitions, especially the artists from Europe and the women artists. She didn’t plan to leave UWA [in 1989] before the new gallery was opened—it would have been a good place to work but her husband had retired and was keen for them to spend more time in their holiday house. She had a great send off—a large group of local artists took her, and husband Ian, to breakfast and presented her with over 100 small scale sculptures and works: “They spoiled me rotten.” 48:00 Post UWA, Rie was asked to be on the selection committee for three new court buildings. She helped the City of Joondalup for several years and became a board member at the Art Gallery of WA before her husband, Ian, died. In 1989 Rie received a letter from Canberra asking if she would accept an Order of Australia. She felt embarrassed as it didn’t seem right to have an honour for doing something she enjoyed doing. She received the award on Australia Day 1990. Rie has often felt an outsider as a migrant and says It can still be hurtful not to be considered Australian. With the OA, for the first time she felt accepted as an Australian. She has no idea who nominated her. 53:34 Reflecting on her life in the Arts community, Rie says she thought she was cheeky to take it on without a Fine Arts degree: “I was thrown in off the deep end and I think I did a reasonable job, which is pleasing, but I think it was a bit of cheek.” 54:30 On the arts community in Perth now: “It’s in a sad position now since the GFC.” Many important galleries have closed their doors which makes it harder now for artists to earn a living: “I don’t know how they’re surviving.” It’s a lot of work for artists to produce the artwork and promote their own work. [Rie makes the point that artists struggling in Western Australia is nothing new. They have always had it a lot harder because of our geographical isolation: “I recently bought a stunning linocut from an artist who has just finished a post-graduate degree at Curtin in Fine Arts and he has to do his work in the evenings as during the day he works as a bus driver. Artists have no easy job and I for one wanted to support them”.] “We’ve gone backwards since the global financial crisis.” The state Art Gallery “can do a lot in supporting young local artists….and dare I say it, they’re not doing that.” Rie says the recent Guy Grey Smith is fantastic and very well curated but notes that it’s taken more than 30 years after his death to mount the exhibition. 58:20 Audio Files Links to audio files <a href="http://oralhistories.arts.uwa.edu.au/files/original/a0005668de710c81c93f3229da8f58b9.mp3">Heymans, Interview 1, Track 1</a> <br /><a href="http://oralhistories.arts.uwa.edu.au/files/original/d64a8e455fa22829da555f2041576c3e.mp3">Heymans, Interview 1, Track 2</a> Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Rie Heymans interview, 7 July 2014 and 10 July 2014 Subject The topic of the resource Art Gallery Description An account of the resource Born in The Hague, Netherlands in 1932, Rie Heymans' early life was informed by wartime Europe, a time she recalls when she was always hungry. Post war, Rie and her husband David left Europe bound for Queensland and it was only Rie’s debilitating onboard sickness that led the couple to leave the ship in Fremantle and settle in Western Australia. Their early migrant years were difficult until David became involved in the local arts community which led, in 1968, to Rie and David, with little experience, opening the Old Fire Station Gallery in Leederville. In the interview, Rie discusses her approach to gallery ownership, the emerging artists she exhibited, and the Perth arts community in the 1960s and 70s. Despite the success of the Old Fire Station Gallery, Rie says of running an art gallery: “It isn’t an easy game.” And hence in 1976, Rie accepted the position of Curator of Pictures at UWA, a position she held until taking early retirement in 1989. Rie talks about the direction she chose to take with the university’s art collection: filling the gaps in the collection and placing an emphasis on collecting women artists. Rie was keen to acquire works by artists who, escaping pre-war Europe, made their homes in Australia and contributed to a more urban view of Australian art. Rie discusses her philosophy towards building the collection; her fund raising events for the new university art gallery. She speaks of the challenges faced by artists today with less money and fewer opportunities. In 1990, Rie was awarded the Order of Australia in recognition of her contribution to the visual arts. Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Heymans, Rie Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available University of Western Australia Historical Society Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource Copyright holder University of Western Australia Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource MP3 files Type The nature or genre of the resource Oral History Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource UWA ORAL HISTORIES Description An account of the resource A collection of interviews with former UWA staff, recorded by the <a href="http://www.alumni.uwa.edu.au/community/historical-society" target="_blank">UWA Historical Society</a> to mark the Centenary of the University in 2013. <br />The UWA Historical Society’s <a href="http://www.alumni.uwa.edu.au/community/historical-society/oral-histories" target="_blank">Oral History Program</a> started as a project with four oral histories funded from Society resources. It was then expanded with support from every Faculty on campus, the Guild, Convocation and through private donations. Additional funding was received through a Heritage Grant. Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available University of Western Australia Historical Society Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource University of Western Australia Historical Society Oral History A resource containing historical information obtained in interviews with persons having firsthand knowledge. Interviewer The person(s) performing the interview John Bannister Interviewee The person(s) being interviewed Kerry Hill Duration Length of time involved (seconds, minutes, hours, days, class periods, etc.) 1 hour, 10 minutes, 27 seconds Bit Rate/Frequency Rate at which bits are transferred (i.e. 96 kbit/s would be FM quality audio) 128 kbs Time Summary A summary of an interview given for different time stamps throughout the interview Track 1 00:00:00 William Kerry Hill. Perth 1943. Background and early recollections. getting interested in architecture. No one is born an architect. Place and travel influences direction. Family background father dies in the Battle of Britain 1943. Mothers connection to the cattle station 00:03:28 Making use of experiences in later work. Coming University of Western Australia. The Perth technical college. Coffee shop in Zimple’s Arcade and the shiralee. Films and snooker. Art classes at the Old Perth Boys high School. A great life. Perth technical college, University of WA 00:05:22 Inspired by the architecture of Perth. Work and play. Friday nights at the Adelphi Hotel. Professional and architectural camaraderie in Perth in the 1960s. Friends with Jeffrey Howlett. Howlett* becomes mentor. The iconic Council House building. Engaging with the profession and the city. Jeffrey Howlett, Council House building, camaraderie. 00:08:00 Architectural faculty starting at UWA. Qualifications needed. 3 year course. First year 1966. Comparisons to tech. Initial impressions. Descriptions of buildings. 16 students have close connections with staff. Broome shire council and the tourist master plan. Roger Johnstone. Peter Middleton buys a combie to travel faculty around Australia. Architecture faculty, Peter Middleton, Roger Johnstone, 00:12:40 Close friendships between staff and students. Memories of Sir Harold Marshall. Peter Middleton. The world of acoustics. Jeffrey Howlett. The state theatre. Middleton brought out of retirement. John Cullen. John White. Roger Johnstone Burma and Asian architecture. Stimulants to go to Asia. Gordon Stephenson was steering the ship. Duncan Richards a marvellous master. Sir Harold Marshall, Peter Middleton, Jeffrey Howlett, John Cullen, John White, Roger Johnstone* 00:17:24 Gallery opening and UWA exhibit for the Biennale*. Janet Holmes a court. Hall green. A community associated with the faculty. A big family. Gordon Stephenson and roger Johnstone. The space of the university inspires. Returning to university. Gordon Stephenson, Janet Holmes a Court, Roger Johnstone, 00:20:30 Descriptions of The Museum of aboriginal cultures. Housing the Berndt Collection. Memories of John White. The running of the course. Core unit design and studio. People sleep under the desk. Learning how to draw. Comparisons of computer. The best designer. Art classes and live nude models. Introduced to the computer. Learning to draw, computer, design, 00:25:00 Learning to build in miniature. Design and model making. Learning in a community of peers. Discussions more than lecture. A closed shop on the campus. Sticking together as a group. No time to do anything else other than architecture. Learning to build, design, peers, 00:29:22 Leaving university and taking the university into career. Technology and architecture. The Concert Hall and capitol theatre. Buildings associated with. Memories of working on The Perth Concert Hall. Leaving university, Perth Concert Hall, technology, 00:32:22 Continual learning on the job. Wanting work in the united states. Working as an architect in Hong Kong and Bali. Field work and Bali. Working in Asia different from experiences in Perth. Aspiring to good architecture. Comparing India and Asian processes of building. Learning on the job, good architecture, Hong Kong, Bali. 00:37:45 Problems with working in Bali. Working 18 hrs a day. Working in designing hotels. Deciding to stop working on hotels. Doing competitions since 2005. State theatre comp and diversification. Bali, hotels, competitions, 00:42:11 Building in place and problem solving and building form and type. Art Gallery of NSW complicated sites. Tough competition. Reciprocal influence between modern principles and traditions of the east. Examples of working Bhutan. Discussion with the Prime Minister of Bhutan. Traditional building in Bhutan. Earthquake resistant buildings. Competition, Traditional, influences, Bhutan 00:48:17 Direct influence and technology transfer. Tradition and building. Influences taken on board. Spirit of buildings. Building light weight in Kyoto. Tradition, influence, technology transfer Track 2 00:00:00 Women in the course. Jean Brodie-Hall and the lay out of the gardens. Looking at the campus. Seeing the trees and the building. The loss of vision of the university. Gus Ferguson departure. The Reid library a bit of a departure. The business school. The sense of place found in the old buildings and the gardens. Ted Snell – 100 favourite things about the university. Jean Brodie-Hall, Gus Ferguson, Ted Snell, loss of vision 00:04:54 Place and space and the growth of the university. Planning and special. The open spaces between the buildings. Gus Ferguson and the growth of the university and plans. Stretching down fairway. Expanding beyond the ground. Gus Ferguson. Off campus buildings. Boundaries. Planning, Gus Ferguson, campus building, 00:07:50 Awarded for work. Aga Kahn Award for Architecture 2001* and Order of Australia Medal. Importance of being awarded an Honorary Doctorate of UWA. 2006 the Royal Australian Institute of Architects Gold Medal. Surprise of awards. Trying to do work better. Involvements of building in Perth. Home coming. State Theatre and Perth City library. Sitting in a building. Winning competitions. Museum close to Kerry Hill. Awards, Home coming, State Theatre, Awards 00:13:40 Completing the circle. Great feelings associated with working across the road from where he studied. Employing UWA graduates. Becoming serious competitors. Graduates of UWA comparing to the best Graduates of the best universities of the world. Mentorship programmes set up with UWA graduates. University graduates, mentorship 00:16:54 Looking from the past to the future. Helping graduates. Remaining close to graduates. Jack London. University placed in the academic community of Perth. Looking at the UWA architectural course. Past and future, Jack London, academic community. Audio Files Links to audio files <a href="http://oralhistories.arts.uwa.edu.au/files/original/5d60ff75b1c8b2899e7c665a1372c550.mp3">Hill, Interview 1, Track 1</a> <br /><a href="http://oralhistories.arts.uwa.edu.au/files/original/5b6e67ad7274f3229e1af1cc616db255.mp3">Hill, Interview 1, Track 2</a> Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Kerry Hill interview, 21 November, 2014 Subject The topic of the resource Architecture Description An account of the resource This is an interview with Kerry Hill, who studied architecture at Perth Technical College before transferring to the University of WA as one of the first intact of architectural students in 1966. He graduating from UWA in 1968. He worked for Howlett & Bailey on projects such as the building of the Perth Concert Hall from 1969 to 1971 before moving to work in Hong Kong and throughout Asia. In 1979 Hill would establish Kerry Hill Architects based in Singapore. During the interview he talks of his memories of coming to UWA and the strong sense of community that he experienced in the faculty of Architecture. He talks of his memories of the university architectural course and the staff he experienced in a close knit group. He speaks of his impressions of how the university has changed, along side discussing how he believes the study of Architecture has changed. He talks of some of his work, including the proposed Museum for Aboriginal Cultures at UWA. He also talks of a sense of homecoming when talking about his work with The State Theatre and The City of Perth Library building. Hill has been awarded for his work, which includes the Aga Khan Award for Architecture 2001, Royal Australian Institute of Architects Gold Medal in 2006. He is also a recipient of the Order of Australia. Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Hill, Kerry Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available University of Western Australia Historical Society Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource Copyright holder University of Western Australia Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource MP3 files Type The nature or genre of the resource Oral history Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource UWA ORAL HISTORIES Description An account of the resource A collection of interviews with former UWA staff, recorded by the <a href="http://www.alumni.uwa.edu.au/community/historical-society" target="_blank">UWA Historical Society</a> to mark the Centenary of the University in 2013. <br />The UWA Historical Society’s <a href="http://www.alumni.uwa.edu.au/community/historical-society/oral-histories" target="_blank">Oral History Program</a> started as a project with four oral histories funded from Society resources. It was then expanded with support from every Faculty on campus, the Guild, Convocation and through private donations. Additional funding was received through a Heritage Grant. Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available University of Western Australia Historical Society Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource University of Western Australia Historical Society Oral History A resource containing historical information obtained in interviews with persons having firsthand knowledge. Interviewer The person(s) performing the interview John Bannister Interviewee The person(s) being interviewed Michael Hobbs Duration Length of time involved (seconds, minutes, hours, days, class periods, etc.) Interview 1: 52 minutes, 10seconds Interview 2: 48 minutes, 42 seconds Interview 3: 27 minutes, 3 seconds Total: 2 hours, 7 minutes, 55 seconds Bit Rate/Frequency Rate at which bits are transferred (i.e. 96 kbit/s would be FM quality audio) 128 kbs Time Summary A summary of an interview given for different time stamps throughout the interview Interview 1 00:00:00 Introduction background information. Athel Hobbs. Architect and Soldier. Desires to do architecture. Abortive year at architecture and starting medicine at UWA. Initial impression of UWA as a student. Residential college in Adelaide. 00:06:10 Making the quota. Undue stress and the general first year since degree. Memories of the Vice Chancellor Currie. Being on campus and the educative view of the world. Rowing at the University Boat Club. Community. University Liberal club. Memories of the ULC float. Frightened to do engineering because of rough initiations. 00:11:50 Students stay all day at UWA. Second year experiences at Adelaide. Integrating and self-sufficiency. Field of medicine specialisation. Undistinguished academic experiences. professorial team at Royal Perth Hospital. Specialising in internal medicine. 00:15:39 Memories and knowledge of Eric Saint and Dick Lefroy. Establishment of medical school. Book – On good Doctoring Eric Saint. Mentor. The contrast between public health system. Professors control the system. Laurie Robson*. Restraints. Suspicions of Eric Saint. Bob Godfrey puts together a team at the Children’s hospital. Attempt to increase standards. 00:21:26 Saint and Lefroy adopt a good philosophy. Inspired to work with Saint and Lefroy. Artificial kidney introduced by Lefroy. Pass exams for College of Physicians. In charge of medical unit. Deputy medical superintendent. 00:22:50 University of Western Australia in the world. 1964 experiences of going to Oxford. Donald Aitchison*. Nuffield Department of Medicine. Mike McCall.* Survey of Multiple Sclerosis. Seeing the medical school and the working of medicine. Doing a DPHil. 00:27:00 Coming back to Perth in 1967. Sir Charles Gairdner Hospital chest hospital and general hospital. Bob Elphick medical team deputy. Epidemiology and social medicine. Nothing like this is Perth. Coming back to do epidemiology research interests. Reader at Monash. Staying in Perth. Vacancy at University of Western Australia Associate Professor. 1970. Fledgling movement for development of social medicine. 00:30:54 Memories of Aitchison.* creating a picture of UWA in the 1960s. Changes to the university seen and discussed. Preclinical sites. Sinclair and Simmons. The culture of Royal Perth Hospital. King Edward Memorial and Princess Margaret Hospital. 00:33:40 Deals done for University land and University-based medical centre. University and non-University people. Research orientation. Relying on permanent medical staff. Contentious issue of payment of surgeons. Associate Professor of Epidemiology. Approach in clinical teaching. Students and patients and the calibre of student. 00:37:30 Currie, Prescott and Whelan. support from the university administration. Allan Robson’s outstanding support. The importance of funding for the university and personal career. Triennial funding and grants. Whitlam collapse changes the situation. Canberra and primary care and general practice. Max Kamien. Staying on in the University Department of Medicine. Commonwealth state funding for the unit of clinical epidemiology in the 1970s. 00:40:20 Importance of funding for research in clinical epidemiology. Developing teaching programs at Royal Perth and Sir Charles Gairdner Hospital. Major problems in development in public health. NH and MRC research funding. Bruce Armstrong and Fiona Stanley. Laurie Beilin sympathetic to a separate school. In the late 1980s the Commonwealth give funding for development of epidemiology and research for Masters in Public Health degrees. 00:42:00 Setting up public health at University of Western Australia and separate department in public health. Memories of Laurie Beilin. Royal Perth Hospital funded posts. Most successful academic at University of Western Australia. NH & MRC projects set up. Social concerns of Laurie Beilin* and Max Kamien. Dick Lefroy founds geriatric services. 00:46:40 Memories of Fiona Stanley overseas training fellowship in NH & MRC. Comes back to work at Charles Gairdner. Takes on the peri natal study. Forms and institute instrumental in medical record linkage in Western Australia. The outcomes of the linkage. Longitudinal studies of health, state-wide hospital reporting system. Bill Davidson. Darcy Holman*. Support of Lotteries Commission. Cancer register – mental health services register - deaths and other linked study. Health services research. Infant mortality. Money becomes available at the right time. Interview 2 00:00:00 Eric Saint – central to the development of the medical school. Turned into the Sir Charles Gairdner site and the University hospital. Fremantle Hospital. Gordon Stevenson plan. Commissioner of public health and state functions of the university. Joint work with university people and state laboratory people. Problems ensue. Richard Court and Michael McCall*. Revitalisation of the service. 00:05:00 Charles Gairdner grows as a hospital and the main focus of the University dep. Rivalries with Royal Perth. Hospitals polarize splitting of the health department, hospitals have own appointments and chairs. Hospital politics. Experience of Wittenoom recalled. Eric Saint recognises industrial disaster in the 1950s. Jim McNalty* health minister. Long term follow up study. Brice Armstrong and Bill Musk. Eric’s deep social concern. 00:11:51 University of Western Australia and the Whitlam government, concern for social and community health. Director of Epidemiology. Health services epidemiology vs. clinical. Support for Dick Lefroy and Fiona Stanley. Seeing the community of University change. Chair in Neurology. 00:16:50 University and honorary academic titles. Research and the perinatal deaths and work done at Oxford elaborated on. University of Western Australia and international collaboration and World Health Organisation Project. MONICA Project. Registers of heart attack. Clear national differences and risk factors and randomised controls. MONIC steering committee. Wittenoom. 00:25:40 Seeing the growth of University of Western Australia and development of population health. Findings of health outcomes in prisoners. Aboriginal prisoners and health. Aboriginal/non-Aboriginal health comparison study. Professor Sandy Thomson* - interest in Indigenous health Judy Kastenberg*. Following people through their history of heart attack and associated illness. Social index. 00:32:44 Global analysis of technological change in health. Project out of Stanford. 00:36:29 Inaugural Head of Department of Public Health. Population issues and clinical medicine. Money and support. Commonwealth support. Laurie Beilin. Increase in brain mass and intellectual stimulation and postgraduate students. Chair in Public Health. University of Western Australia school in an up phase. Department and school in its own right. Amalgamation with social work. 00:42:30 Administration and leverage. David Fletcher* and Fremantle Hospital collaboration. Perinatal studies, geriatric services, gall bladder, heart disease and record linkage. 00:47:43 University of Western Australia global standing. Interview 3 00:00:00 Involvement with scientific and professional associations. Royal Australia College of Physicians, Faculty of Public Health Medicine, Public Health Association of Australia, Australasian Epidemiological Association. Australian Medical Association. Involvement with the Silver Chain Nursing Association. Work for the Department of Health. Home and community care program. The HAC program. 00:04:26 Implicit understanding to be involved in community organisations. Order of Australia Medal. Starting professional associations. The Australian Epidemiological Association. Population medicine. Growth of Medical School. Advocacy. Curriculum review. 00:07:50 Quoting Eric Saint on the more affluent years of the 1960s. The ‘halcyon period’. Sidney Sax brings a social perspective to organisation of the health services. NH&MRC grants RAD* grants. Support of students and placement of individuals abroad and at home. 00:11:00 Fiona Stanley and Bruce Armstrong go onto bigger things. Teaching and advice. Change of the sense of community. Changes in technology and affects at the university. Difficult to enthuse undergraduate medical students. The changing face of the university student. 00:17:05 Areas of success in student medical research. International students. Problems with the education of Malaysian students. UWA and the international arena. 00:22:45 Recognition of low numbers of medical students. Pressures of increased student numbers. Competition between universities and the academic standing of University of Western Australia. Proposed merger with Murdoch. Good times and bad times. Views of University of Western Australia today. 00:27:02 End of session Audio Files Links to audio files <a href="http://oralhistories.arts.uwa.edu.au/files/original/aea4bcf1dec42c277132a05ccb3e6c00.mp3">Hobbs, Interview 1, Track 1</a> <br /><a href="http://oralhistories.arts.uwa.edu.au/files/original/3526d9700360ce118149e427e97eb340.mp3">Hobbs, Interview 2, Track 1</a> <br /><a href="http://oralhistories.arts.uwa.edu.au/files/original/a11e569568d03fdacb3f21ed4e4e382c.mp3">Hobbs, Interview 3, Track 1</a> Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Michael Hobbs interview, 24 January 2013 Subject The topic of the resource Medicine Description An account of the resource This is an interview with Emeritus Professor Michael Hobbs. Professor Hobbs studied medicine at the University of Western Australia, University of Adelaide and Oxford University. He became Associate Professor of Epidemiology in 1970 and of Social Preventative Medicine in 1974. In 1991 he became the inaugural Head of the Department of Public Health. He has worked in association with people such as Fiona Stanley and Bruce Armstrong. Professor Hobbs has been involved with numerous studies into public health, including Perinatal studies, and was part of the steering committee for the World Health Organisation study into Cardiovascular disease. He was awarded an Order of Australia medal in 1994. Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Hobbs, Michael Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available University of Western Australia Historical Society Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource Copyright holder University of Western Australia Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource MP3 files Type The nature or genre of the resource Oral History Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource UWA ORAL HISTORIES Description An account of the resource A collection of interviews with former UWA staff, recorded by the <a href="http://www.alumni.uwa.edu.au/community/historical-society" target="_blank">UWA Historical Society</a> to mark the Centenary of the University in 2013. <br />The UWA Historical Society’s <a href="http://www.alumni.uwa.edu.au/community/historical-society/oral-histories" target="_blank">Oral History Program</a> started as a project with four oral histories funded from Society resources. It was then expanded with support from every Faculty on campus, the Guild, Convocation and through private donations. Additional funding was received through a Heritage Grant. Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available University of Western Australia Historical Society Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource University of Western Australia Historical Society Oral History A resource containing historical information obtained in interviews with persons having firsthand knowledge. Interviewer The person(s) performing the interview Anne Yardley Interviewee The person(s) being interviewed John Inverarity Location The location of the interview Claremont, W.A. Duration Length of time involved (seconds, minutes, hours, days, class periods, etc.) 1 hour, 53 minutes, 15 seconds Bit Rate/Frequency Rate at which bits are transferred (i.e. 96 kbit/s would be FM quality audio) 128 kbs Time Summary A summary of an interview given for different time stamps throughout the interview 00:00 Introduction by Anne Yardley. 00:37 Robert John Inverarity born 31 January 1944, Claremont. Mother Helen born 1908, Father Mervyn, born 1907 was a chartered accountant and talented cricketer. John enjoyed a happy childhood with many friends exploring the neighbourhood and playing sport, especially football and cricket . Schools: North Cottesloe Primary School followed by Scotch College. John loved the sport, the team spirit and the sense of community at Scotch. 5:55 He captained the school cricket and football [Australian Rules] teams. On a visit to WACA [Western Australian Cricket Association] aged six John envisaged he would one day play for Western Australia; he was selected to play for WA before starting university. 07:20 John’s ambition on leaving school was to teach. His father encouraged university studies and so he became the first in his family to go to university. He has always considered himself a teacher who played cricket, rather than a cricketer who taught. He had an idealistic streak and wanted to make a difference through teaching. Being part of a school community appealed to him. 09:50 Although very keen on cricket, teaching was John’s prime interest. As Chairman of Selectors for Cricket Australia, he has urged young cricketers to have a life—career and friendships— away from cricket to develop as people and sportsmen. When John retired after playing first class cricket he had a career to sustain him through the transition, unlike many other sportspeople. 13.20 Teaching fitted well with a cricket career. John chose UWA to avoid becoming a bonded teacher. Rod Marsh, Tony Mann and John ran cricket camps to help support their university studies. He completed an Arts degree majoring in maths and a Diploma of Education. He easily found a job teaching maths at Guildford Grammar and loved his two years there. 16:10 He loved his years at UWA; his major engagement with university was through cricket and football where he formed friendships. All day, from 8am, was spent on campus—at lectures, tutorials, in the library and with friends. 17:25 Cricket at UWA was pivotal: he was given responsibilities, opportunities and there were expectations made of him. Within two years, he was captain of the first grade side and won premierships. The combination of responsibility, opportunity, expectation and carefree times matured him. 18:25 He recalls Alan Robson, former Vice-Chancellor of UWA, telling students: “if you leave this university only with a degree, then we will have failed you.” 19:30 John found university academic life impersonal and remote, with some exceptions. He didn’t engage with learning as he had at school. He believes the university is better at engaging students now. Teaching styles have changed since the 1960s. 21:00 John enjoyed playing A grade football at university with Tony McCartney and Tim Kiernan, now well respected doctors, winning two premierships. University football was amateur whereas the cricket fed into the State team. 23:00 He was very disciplined at juggling the different demands on his time at university. In 1963 John sat his first three university exams in Sydney on the mornings of Sheffield Shield matches. While teaching and during home games, he would teach the first two lessons before hurrying to the WACA, play cricket, collect the school work, mark and get it back to students the next day. It was important to him that his students were supported, they were his priority. 25: 35 Arthur Williams was UWA’s registrar and patron of the cricket club during John’s student days and was very supportive. It “nearly broke my heart” to miss a Sheffield Shield tour because of exams. The then Chairman of Selectors was also a teacher and sympathetic. 27:15 John taught at Guildford Grammar for two years, 1967-8, and was away for nearly six months of 1968. He then moved to the government sector and taught at Applecross Senior High School, believing it would be easier to get teaching cover than in the independent sector. 28:25 He met his future wife, Jane McPherson, through his local church, St Aiden’s. They married in 1969 on a Monday night as it was his only night away from cricket commitments. Rod and Ros Marsh married six days earlier on a Tuesday night. Daughter Alison was born in 1970 and Kate in 1972. 30.45 John played six Test matches: two in the England tour 1968, one test 1968-9 and again in 1972 where he played three tests. Wives and families didn’t usually travel with teams then, but Jane and others did that year. 32:00 Playing Test cricket is, he says, a roller coaster ride; it builds resilience. Jane would provide the balance between high and lows. He remembers walking out to bat for Australia for the first time and was very excited but he was also excited walking out to bat for his school team at age 13– gradual incremental steps. Both the praise and criticism is excessive: “if you can’t survive that, you won’t last very long”. 34:25 Friendships have been important throughout his career. As Headmaster at Hale School, he believed in holistic education. Pastoral care was at the forefront and was best done through activities—working and playing together. In cricket the same: “I think friendships form best when you do things together. That’s the medium through which you get to know each other.” 36:40 When John became Headmaster at Hale in 1989, he was given the advice that he should stay aloof, but that style didn’t suit him. Whether captain, coach or headmaster, it is the position that sets people apart, he says, but he personally operates better on a more egalitarian, less formal, basis. 38:10 When coaching Warwickshire (from 2003), a South African player who found it difficult to address him informally, as John insisted, settled on “Opa” meaning grandfather. Now John is Opa to his grandchildren. 40:30 At Hale School John tried to teach students to have different forms of behaviour according to what was appropriate for different situations. At St George’s College he encouraged students to have respect for the position as well as the person and mentions occasions when visited by former Prime Ministers and the Vice Chancellor. As a teacher and headmaster he ensured he knew each student’s name. He considered it a mark of respect to the student. 43:35 As a teacher at Scotch College in 1969, during David Priest’s tenure as Head, he learnt the importance of appointing the right staff; the importance of creating an environment where staff flourish. 45:20 John has enjoyed all his teaching positions: “I love it, love it”. In 1976-7 he taught at Tunbridge School, Kent and became friends with England captain, Colin Cowdrey whose sons were at the school. He has maintained friendships with people there. 47:00 John became deputy head at Pembroke School, Adelaide while still playing cricket. Daughters, Alison and Kate went to Pembroke—a co-educational school and a different teaching experience: “a slightly chaotic but wonderful school.” During this time, he took a year’s exchange to King’s College School, Wimbledon. 48:10 He has debated whether co-ed or same sex schools are better. What matters more, he believes, is the whole tone of the school: the learning and teaching environment and the quality of the relationships. He liked the co-ed experience at Pembroke and at Hale the aims and objectives were changed to allow co-ed as a possibility. The idea was met favourably by some but with fierce opposition from others. It created an interesting debate. 50:00 John came to headmastership at Hale with clear ideas on education: “I have always been of the view that there is nothing more important in our society than the raising of our young.” His vision was for educated, competent, decent people to contribute to society. He abolished caning at the school and insisted students were called by their first names. He wanted all subjects to flourish and fostered music and drama. He encouraged kindness and respect. 53:30 Caning was still in use in many schools—less at Scotch in the 1970s than at Hale in the late 1980s and common at Guildford Grammar. At Hale, John made the rule that only the Headmaster could use the cane, and he didn’t use it. John was expected to cane at Guildford and did so: “never again, ever, ever.” He found it abhorrent. By the time he abolished caning at Hale it was becoming less common. 55:34 While Headmaster, John continued to teach at Hale considering it important to be in the classroom and involved in all activities. Leadership is about service, about being involved, he believes. There are different approaches to the role of the principal. John’s style was to know each student, many good principals operate differently. 59:00 John’s mentors: Bill Dickinson, Headmaster at Scotch during John’s teaching years. There were colleagues at Hale who were confidants and very wise men with a sense of expectation and of trust. 1:00:20 Accountability and trust: while there needs to be a level of accountability in recent years there’s been an increase in an emphasis on accountability. Checking up on people comes at the erosion of trust. He believes people respond better when trusted. He describes how he responded positively to his colleagues at Hale who gave him their trust. It brought out the best in him. 1:02:00 When John came to St George’s College he was told that he needed to stay on top of the students. For John, the relationship is a partnership with him as a moderating force who shows trust. Alan Robson, UWA, was a wonderful leader with astute judgment who showed respect. He empowered others. John tried to empower staff at Hale. 1:04:55 At the end of 2002, John finished 14 years at Hale. He felt he’d given what he could and that the school would benefit from fresh input. After a coaching and teaching stint in England and at Notre Dame University, Fremantle, he wanted to get back into education and was offered the position of Warden of St George’s College. 1:07:00 When at Hale, John told students it was expected that they would do their best and the school community depended on their contribution. The way to contribute was through each person’s personal qualities: kindness, consideration, helpfulness. Students at good schools find it easier to be engaged than students at university who are only on campus for tutorials and some lectures as these are now online. 1:09:40 University offers a fantastic life for students who involve themselves in the university community: “I think it’s a great pity that so many students go to university without getting engaged.” A residential college offers full immersion and John is a huge supporter of college life. John was Warden of St George’s College for six years and on recent visits sees the college continue to develop. He recalls a visit by John Howard, former Prime Minister, and believes the students lives were enhanced by the experience of dinner and a question and answer session with Mr Howard. The college offers scholarships and prizes, doing well is valued. Third and fourth year students take tutorials for younger students. 1:11:50 A key to college life is communal dining and St George’s has a rule that students can’t save seats but must sit where there are places, thereby getting to know each other: “Everybody was expected to know everybody else”. Dinner conversations were lively, well informed discussions. A music program was developed that included tuition, a Winthrop Singers Choir sang Evensong at the Chapel. Very interesting visitors were invited to speak at fireside chats . There was a scholarly atmosphere. John recalls Alex Wood, a medical student, and others, giving carefully prepared tutorials. 1:14:40 “The learning and teaching environment was just of the highest quality.” Dynamic, purposeful, focused but relaxed. That builds a learning community with wide ranging interests and cross fertilisation amongst students. Sport was played on Sunday, again, to build community. Strong relationships were developed. John has maintained contact and former students visit his home for networking and mentoring evenings. 1:17:10 John explains the difference between halls of residence where “a bit went on, but not much more”. What should set colleges apart is the quality of offerings outside the mere dining and living experience. He places Oxford and Cambridge at the top, mentions Trinity College, University of Melbourne next, and ranks St George’s College as being several rungs lower but striving. With new accommodation the numbers of students in residence is increasing; John is very supportive. The difficulty will be offering the full college experience with many more students. Proximity to campus means students are more likely to become involved with university life. 1:20:00 Students in the UK tend to leave home to go away for university which has not been the experience in Australia. This is a pity. There is a “brain drain” from Perth with students going to Sydney, Melbourne, and the ANU. Colleges are especially useful for country students to immerse themselves in the college environment. The Warden’s role is to create the leadership, the enthusiasm and environment in which students “take the bit by the teeth”. 1:22:50 In a college, as in a school, teachers could start to cruise when peer group pressure reached the point teachers wanted it to be when: “it was cool to work hard; it was cool to acknowledge excellence; it was cool to be kind and considerate; it was cool to be respectful and tolerant; it was cool to appreciate the music and drama if you were a sportsman; it was cool to watch the footy team if your thing was music and drama.” Teachers lead by the signals, subtle reminders they give. For instance, at Hale sports reports were traditionally mentioned first, John put arts first, it needed the encouragement. 1:25:15 David Newby, who had been at school with John, became a Rhodes Scholar and was at St George’s. That was an important time for David which he acknowledged by giving the college $50,000 a year for five years which allowed for art classes, music classes and others. 1:26:40 Student base at St George’s: about 70% from rural Western Australia; 20% from overseas; 10% interstate and metropolitan students. John ensured there was a needs based approach to accepting students, for instance, the “mythical student from Kalbarri High School” and wanted to give these students an opportunity. Most settled in well with the welcoming environment. John would interview 150 applicants for the 70 or 80 places. He was conscious to allow the less confident students the chance to attend the college and to flourish. 1:30:20 For Young Australian of the Year [2013], Akram Azimi attending St George’s College was a life changing experience. John recounts his first meeting with Akram suggesting he apply to the College but he lacked the funds. John managed to obtain a scholarship for Akram who went on to spend four or five years at the College. He studied science, law and arts. He conducted tutorials in anthropology, anatomy, biology: “He was extraordinary.” 1:35:00 John doesn’t believe it is possible to solve the problem of inequity in offering places to worthy students. “Each one is a gold nugget and his [Akram’s] was a very shiny gold nugget.” More scholarships are needed. Andrew Forrest is putting 15 million [dollars] into a post graduate college to be affiliated with St George’s College which will include scholarships. “Scholarships are very, very important.” Present Warden, Ian Harding, taught at Christ Church, has a background in banking and is a good financier. John mentions the American model where enrolments are made on merit and those who can pay contribute extra to a coffer, those who can’t receive help from that coffer, plus endowments. A way can be found for students without the means: “we’re babes in the wood in that regard in Australia but St George’s collect has gone a bit in that direction and is getting better.” 1:37:20 John would like to see all UWA students spend one or two years in a College, meaning more places must be made available. Costs would be considerable. St George’s College has been going since 1931 and has received significant endowments, initially from Hackett who built the college with support. Providing college life for all is a long way off. 1:39:20 John would like to see more money coming from the public purse but doesn’t see this as a priority for public money. Primary and secondary education, support for the disadvantage are higher priorities. He believes it would be rewarding for people with financial means to support students at college and enjoy that relationship. 1:41:30 After six years John felt he had given what he could to St George’s College. He was approached by Cricket Australia and believed he would enjoy that experience [as Chairman of Selectors] but that in time he would like to be involved with a college again. He’s now spent two and a half years with the cricket selectors. He and wife, Jane, have travelled and became involved with that community. It has been a demanding job which he has enjoyed but not as satisfying or demanding as running a school such as Hale. 1:43:45 There have been two very strong strands in John’s life: education and cricket. In cricket he most enjoyed captaincy, having responsibility for the team, being in charge and attempting to create an environment where the whole was greater than the sum of the parts. The most important element in coaching is creating an environment in which players do their best—where they thrive and are a cohesive unit. That comes from trust, confidence, mentoring. Having that role fascinated John and is common to cricket captaincy, coaching, headmastership, teaching in the classroom and St George’s College, and with the family: “That’s who I think I am”. Someone who likes challenges. 1:46:50 John is now going to England [June 2014] to contribute to a leadership and mentoring workshop: “I’m not ready to stop looking for challenges.” While still not ready for retirement, he is ready to work less hard. John maintains a connection with St George’s College, recently giving a successful fireside chat and enjoying Evensong and concerts. He is a member of the UWA Senate: the Board of Governors of the University. He loves the involvement and the environment of young people gaining confidence and qualifications to make a difference in the world. 1:49:30 Family is a very important part of John’s life. He and Jane have been married 45 years. Daughters Alison and Kate are both married, in Melbourne, and each has two children. The Cricket Australia position has allowed John and Jane to spend time in Melbourne and to take their grandchildren to the MCG. He would like to see his grandchildren benefit from spending time in a university college in the future. Audio Files Links to audio files <a href="http://oralhistories.arts.uwa.edu.au/files/original/604a662715fc471b95ae5d4afce57748.mp3">Inverarity, Interview 1, Track 1</a> Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource John Inverarity interview, 9 June 2014 Subject The topic of the resource St George's College Description An account of the resource Robert John Inverarity was born in Claremont in 1944. His father, Mervyn, was a talented cricketer and instilled a love of the game in his son who played both cricket and football throughout his school years at North Cottesloe Primary School and Scotch College and later at the University of Western Australia where he completed an Arts degree majoring in mathematics followed by a teaching diploma. During his university and early teaching years John juggled exams, teaching and the demands of playing Sheffield Shield and Test cricket. He continued to combine teaching and cricket in a career that saw him play in six Test matches beginning in 1968 as the opening batsman for Australia. He captained both the WA and South Australian Sheffield Shield teams and later coached county cricket in England. His teaching career took him to the Headmastership of Hale School, a position he held between 1989 and 2003. After 14 years at the helm of Hale School, John accepted the position of Warden of St George’s College at UWA, a role he held for six years. Always ready for the next challenge, in 2012, John left St George’s College to become Chairman of Selectors for Cricket Australia. This interview takes place in June 2014 as he steps down from this position and contemplates his next challenge. Retirement is not yet on the horizon for John Inverarity. Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Inverarity, John Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available University of Western Australian Historical Society Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource Copyright holder University of Western Australia Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource MP3 files Type The nature or genre of the resource Oral History Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource UWA ORAL HISTORIES Description An account of the resource A collection of interviews with former UWA staff, recorded by the <a href="http://www.alumni.uwa.edu.au/community/historical-society" target="_blank">UWA Historical Society</a> to mark the Centenary of the University in 2013. <br />The UWA Historical Society’s <a href="http://www.alumni.uwa.edu.au/community/historical-society/oral-histories" target="_blank">Oral History Program</a> started as a project with four oral histories funded from Society resources. It was then expanded with support from every Faculty on campus, the Guild, Convocation and through private donations. Additional funding was received through a Heritage Grant. Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available University of Western Australia Historical Society Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource University of Western Australia Historical Society Oral History A resource containing historical information obtained in interviews with persons having firsthand knowledge. Interviewer The person(s) performing the interview John Bannister Interviewee The person(s) being interviewed Max Kamien Duration Length of time involved (seconds, minutes, hours, days, class periods, etc.) Interview 1: 52 minutes, 46 seconds Interview 2: 55 minutes, 26 seconds Interview 3: 59 minutes, 8 seconds Total: 2 hours, 47 minutes, 20 seconds Bit Rate/Frequency Rate at which bits are transferred (i.e. 96 kbit/s would be FM quality audio) 128 kbs Time Summary A summary of an interview given for different time stamps throughout the interview Interview 1 00:00:00 Charles St North Perth 1936. Family background. Warsaw and New York, Palestine, Russia, Melbourne. Encouraged to come to Perth, Western Australia. Mother’s jobs. Survivors of the Holocaust. 00:07:00 Memories of schooling and Ernie Smith. North Perth and Modern School. Playing tennis inspired by school. Memories of Perth Modern School. Anti-Semitic teachers. Jeremiah Haire* Morris Zines* inspired career direction. Saviour c’est pouvior. Seventy. 00:13:15 Medicine and first-year science. Camp for Kids Club – jewel in the crown of University of Western Australia. Tennis. Memories of UWA. Orientation, Brian Stokes. Memories of Adelaide and Adelaide University. Meeting Sir Cedric Stanton-Hicks*. Doctor Lippay*. Prof Peter Kampf*. Dr Lippay story. Leben Prize* and Nobel Prize. 00:20:25 Memories of Adelaide and the Colombo Plan. Medical School starts at University of Western Australia. The Medical School – long gestation and appeal. Public subscription. Wonderful age for the students and teachers. Eric Saint brings back ideas from Cleveland. Co-mingle day. 00:25:35 Co-mingle king and Walter Murdoch. Lions of the Worth’s Circus. Tania Verstak was Miss World. Devoting life to children of spasticity. Percy Cerruty comes to the University. 00:29:30 Keeping good relationships with teacher. Ken Pawsey and Dick Lefroy were role models. Whipple’s disease* and malabsorption. Invited to the inner sanctum. Not a very good student. 00:34:05 A place to inspire the individuals. Being editor of the Reflex magazine. Mengele was to get PhD and the NAZI doctors. The Speculum. Little Red Riding Hood. And rock around the cock. The Stone Age contraceptive. Burning of the reflex. Issue number 4 of the Pelican also burned. Geoffrey Bolton*. 00:39:18 Professor Ten Seldam is a nice bully. Eric Saint and Neville Stanley invite me for a beer. Memories of Saint and Stanley. Wittenoom mine. Dick Lefroy. Getting to know the surgeons. Mother gets cancer and medical etiquette. Not charging students. 00:44:19 Eric Saint and graduation ceremony. Paediatricians were excellent. McDonald* and Lewis. Neville Stanley was ebullient and enthusiastic. Staff student sporting things. Schistosomiasis in the Ord River. Way ahead of Salk* and Polio. Memories of Harry Rees*. Memories of Gordon King. Had hypothyroid condition. Never get a class with only 15 people in it again. Interview 2 00:00:00 Eric Saint and the colours of the gown for the university. Aboriginal health and the Medical School. General Practice and rural health and going to Collie in 1959. Eric Saint is the visionary person. Medical school appeal and rural medicine. Setting up a Country Medical Foundation. Country people hold Medical School in bad odour in the 1970s. 00:05:40 Translation of the vision of the School to professors. Aboriginal concerns of no concern. Working with refugees and being aware of minorities. Support of influential people in the UK. Psychologist for Bourke* in NSW. Seeing sick Indigenous children. Going into private practice. Being a doctor for Aborigines. Changing things. 00:11:00 Documenting illness. Importance of writing papers. Getting houses for people. ABSCHOL Aboriginal scholarships. Housing co-op through loss of money. Speaking to Mr Whitlam. Fred Hollows and trachoma. Dame Ida Mann, St John of Jerusalem Eye Hospital. John Cawte and Leslie Kiloh*. 00:16:00 Fred Hollows insults people. People warm to Hollows. Setting up the Aboriginal Medical Service in Perth. Admission of Aboriginal students to Medical School. Pathfinder. 00:19:00 Encouragement of Saint and rural service. Influence of Harry Rees. Working in fourth-world conditions in Australia. Australia is a very racist country. Money disappears. Kununurra an Apartheid town. Argyle mine and places in the town. 1996 opposition to core curriculum for Aboriginal study. 00:23:50 Coming back to the University - Foundation Professor Dick Joske*. Reasons for patient being in hospital. Easy to teach. Being bored with hospital medicine. 00:28:50 Karmel Enquiry 1973. Time is ripe to set up community practice. General practice and the Whitlam government. Health centre medicine. Nicola Roxon and centres. Committee of twelve and ideas for the health centres. Kevin Cullen and Busselton survey. College of GPs was a little club. 00:33:15 A compromise candidate was given the position. First guinea pig. Passing the exam. Offered the Chair. Kevin goes berserk and goes to the press. Changes to the school. Traditional English medical school. Easier to win a war than make change to the curriculum. Reasons for Saint leaving. 00:37:45 Promise to Western Australian population had been forgotten. Medical school and its purpose. People don’t have a big picture, major opponents now claim stewardship. A dissident and being valued for seeing things differently. 00:40:15 Aboriginal students and rural students would not get into Medicine at UWA. Figures disputed. Professor Sandra Eades* nurtured by Fiona Stanley. The connection between staff and student is still close. Bogged down in bureaucracy. 00:45:25 Vision of a career. Academic community and the 1970s. Controversy and closing of ranks. Whelan and Jackson and the Cullen family. Plot of the university to get their own man. Suing the Cullens and the College of GPs. Unit of the Department of Medicine. The last group of Community Practice to be formed in Western Australia. Money is redirected. 00:50:43 Boyle refuses to see Kamien. Embezzlers of $550,000 go to gaol. Getting some money and some employees. David Treloar*. Medicine takes all the money. Faculty opposes move to Claremont. Michael McCall* Associate Prof of Medicine changes his mind. Reduction of money. Tough go. Interview 3 00:00:00 Naive not getting a place in the system till 1985, in curriculum review committee. Stalling of process. Back to square one. Rural general practice rated highly. Financial difficulties in WA. Something wrong with an organisation that goes to all the effort to appoint somebody and then makes it so difficult for them... the gang of four. Dean, Deputy Dean, Michael McCall and Head of Department of Medicine. Finance for General Practice. Writing to Bob Street . Faculty cuts. Max Walters. No cuts. University fripperies of English, Anthropology, Archaeology, General Practice. 00:04:41Apology of Bob Street. Things are going to change. Conditions of the architect. Thanking Vice Chancellor. Universities can be very bloody places indeed. Robert Smith. Did not want Claremont for general practice. University dealings with Claremont. Deprived suburb of Lockridge. Setting up a practice without money from the University 00:09:45 Buying house and setting up a practice. Holman a person that makes dreams come true. Nugget Coombs. Dr. Underwood. Self-funding in two weeks. Going bankrupt. Losing department in Fremantle Hospital. Payroll tax. 00:12:22 Becoming bankrupt. $130,000 and fines of $6000 Steven Schwartz* and the faculty of medicine. Robert Smith impressed with Lockridge. Money and department allocation. 00:14:20 Memories of being a minority discipline in UWA. Kamien’s appointment was controversial. Suffering from the onslaught of Royal Australian College of General Practice. Curriculum review. No plan B. Trying to get a place in the medical curriculum. Getting into the curriculum by 1982. Catchpole had a three-week stint of emergency medicine. Used for rural attachments. Professor Catchpole gives up time for another discipline. 00:17:40 Trying desperately hard. The Deans were not interested. Lockridge’s situation. Setting up a demonstration practice. No support from the Faculty of Medicine. University forward-looking principle. Richard Angeloni*. Starting with interest free money. Lockridge practice brought prestige to the University. Max Walters completely antagonistic. 00:20:10 Bureaucracy tries to postpone things. Money worries for the Festival of Perth and Colleges. Ulterior worry. Time-wasting affair. Support of Norman Palmer and Dick Joske*. Joske became a rural convert. Memories of the games played by the Deans. People don’t know the University system. Ian Passmore made it easier. 00:24:15 40% of time spent fighting battles. Strengths of teaching affected. Professor Lourens* was a time-waster. University politics. Fighting for salaries. Not approved by Carmen Lawrence - working hospital. Pay the same as a junior senior lecturer. Professor getting higher pay than Head of School. 00:29:00 Senate and the blue rinse set. Selling of the Claremont practice. Loss of money of the University. General Practice and a Clinical Department. Describing Fred Hollows. University seeing benefit if it was seen to be earning money. 00:32:30 University would not change in any sense unless they were earning money. University never turns down money. Regrets about not making a life at University of Western Australia. Complaints about University system. 00:35:10 Position of Professor is devalued. Clinical medicine and the mates of the Dean. Not getting on the committee. Staying as an Adjunct Professor. Winthrop Professors and the American scheme. 00:38:40 Awarded for community work. Work in Kununurra*. Medical services for poor and others. Aboriginal health was seen to lower the tone. Huge numbers of students can’t be coped with. Notre Dame. Personal teaching in rural areas and teaching hospital. 00:42:40 Paying for conferences out of own pocket. Getting awards. Citizen of the Year. Order of Australia. The ‘in crowd’ of UWA and CURTIN. Getting reasonable recognition. Motivations. Revolving door of Aboriginal health. Treating overseas doctors. 00:47:30 International standing of the Department of Medicine. Medical graduates from OS. Getting money from OS students dilutes and quality. Money-making business. Lack of government support. Spin business and ratings. Personal position of professor. Benefits. 00:50:29 Memories of being ship’s doctor and Antarctic expeditions. Age is not a problem. An adventure and interest in scurvy in Kalgoorlie. The Barcoo Rot from the Barcoo River. Country and University judged by the way it treats its minorities. Summing up grateful to University of Western Australia. Audio Files Links to audio files <a href="http://oralhistories.arts.uwa.edu.au/files/original/b745bdddcdbc3da2c10d239cd327fc06.mp3">Kamien, Interview 1, Track 1</a> <br /><a href="http://oralhistories.arts.uwa.edu.au/files/original/0eef54897a59785c12ad01020ac7a2dd.mp3">Kamien, Interview 1, Track 2</a> <br /><a href="http://oralhistories.arts.uwa.edu.au/files/original/d3963d82f61e78d928742e46bffa3461.mp3">Kamien, Interview 1, Track 3</a> Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Max Kamien interview, 2 October 2012 Subject The topic of the resource Medicine Description An account of the resource A graduate of the University of Western Australia, Emeritus Professor Max Kamien would become Foundation Professor of General Practice at the University in 1976. Professor Kamien has a long history of working with those less-fortunate in Australia and overseas. He was instrumental in the establishment of the Western Australian Centre for Remote and Rural Medicine, an organisation which financially supports rural medical undergraduates to complete medical degrees and return to practice in rural WA. Professor Kamien continues to work at the Ord Valley Aboriginal Medical Service in Kununurra. He has been awarded for his commitment to education within rural communities and for his efforts to improve the health of Indigenous Australians. Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Kamien, Max Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available University of Western Australia Historical Society Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource Copyright holder University of Western Australia Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource MP3 files Type The nature or genre of the resource Oral History Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource UWA ORAL HISTORIES Description An account of the resource A collection of interviews with former UWA staff, recorded by the <a href="http://www.alumni.uwa.edu.au/community/historical-society" target="_blank">UWA Historical Society</a> to mark the Centenary of the University in 2013. <br />The UWA Historical Society’s <a href="http://www.alumni.uwa.edu.au/community/historical-society/oral-histories" target="_blank">Oral History Program</a> started as a project with four oral histories funded from Society resources. It was then expanded with support from every Faculty on campus, the Guild, Convocation and through private donations. Additional funding was received through a Heritage Grant. Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available University of Western Australia Historical Society Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource University of Western Australia Historical Society Oral History A resource containing historical information obtained in interviews with persons having firsthand knowledge. Interviewer The person(s) performing the interview Julia Wallis Interviewee The person(s) being interviewed Antoinette Kennedy Location The location of the interview Trigg, W.A. Duration Length of time involved (seconds, minutes, hours, days, class periods, etc.) Interview 1: 1 hour, 13 minutes, 36 seconds Interview 2: 1 hour, 6 minutes, 55 seconds Interview 3: 1 hour, 19 minutes, 42 seconds Total: 3 hours, 40 minutes, 13 seconds Bit Rate/Frequency Rate at which bits are transferred (i.e. 96 kbit/s would be FM quality audio) 128 kbs Time Summary A summary of an interview given for different time stamps throughout the interview Interview 1 Track 1 00:00 Introduction by Julia Wallis 00:33 Track 2 00:00 Antoinette Kennedy was born on 18 May 1945 in Mount Hawthorn. Her family were of Irish extraction but had been in WA for several generations. The family lived on an acre of land in Roberts Street, Joondanna. Antoinette’s father had a trotting stable. Family members lived around the suburb. Her father and aunt both attended St Kieran’s Catholic Primary School. Her mother left school at the age of 14. 06:11 Antoinette’s grandfather was a Bailiff. Her mother worked in the office and then worked with her husband who was a fruit and vegetable wholesaler. Most of the produce went to Stations in the Norwest. Antoinette attended St Keiran’s. Boys left in third grade and then to Christian Brothers in Leederville. The teaching was not of a high standard but the nuns were a good example of what women could achieve. 14:36 Antoinette did her Junior at St Kieran’s and did her Leaving at Leederville Technical College. The lectures at Leederville Technical College were inspiring. She was the first student from St Keiran’s to attend university. Antoinette’s mother encouraged her to go on to higher education as she didn’t get the chance herself. Her mother valued education for its own sake but also stressed on Antoinette the need to be financially independent. 22:08 In the 1960s, women who worked in an office or for the Public Service had to give up work once they got married. Teaching was mooted as an option. In first year at UWA, students had to do two Arts subjects as part of their Law degree. Professor Beasley suggested Antoinette take Philosophy rather than Psychology. She studied Legal History and Constitutional Law. The Law School was small and enclosed like a college. It was located near Broadway. Students were expected to maintain a good standard of dress and wore gowns to lectures. 28:32 Antoinette did not know anybody in the Law School. In her year, there were two girls from Presbyterian Ladies College and another from Mount Lawley High School. A girl from Hong Kong returned there after graduating. The girls would discuss clothes and make up and the Law Ball in the locker room. Antoinette was ‘dating’ for her last two years at Law School. It was fairly easy to find partners at university. 35:00 Antoinette is still friends with some of the male students she met at Law School. Numbers whittled down – especially after First Year. Antoinette did not find law difficult but she did have to learn how to study. The full-time lecturers were assisted by professionals who lectured part-time. Professor Payne arrived from Oxford in 1963. He became Dean and Professor Beasley retired. Professor Payne encouraged Richard Harding to join UWA. Harding referred to the students as “Idle toads”. Marking became stricter. The Law School started to change under Payne. 43:32 The part-time lecturers had a different approach. John Toohey was a part time lecturer who became a High Court Judge. Learning to read cases was very important especially when Payne and Harding arrived. Law students were encouraged to visit the High Court in 3rd and 4th year. Newsworthy cases at the time were the trials of John Button and Darryl Beamish. There was also a lecturer at UWA who was convicted of manslaughter for the shooting of his disabled son. Professor Edwards who lectured in Criminal Law observed that the students were not sympathetic to the father. 48:15 Annette was not part of the moot team but recalls going to Melbourne to support the UWA team. 52:14 Antoinette enjoyed being on campus and going to the Refectory for morning tea and lunch. She recalled male students from Law and Engineering having a tug of war across the Reflection Pond. People did one off fun things rather than organised things. It was very carefree. English lectures were huge with lots of students. Antoinette did not challenge authority and felt that most of the students fitted their values and opinions to those of their tutors and lecturers. While studying a poem in the Woman’s Common Room near the Refectory, Antoinette was assisted by Dorothy Hewett . 58:45 Antoinette did not know which area of the law she wanted to practice in. Ted Sharp always intended to go into commercial law. Others were going into a family firm. Women were not encouraged in the same way to set goals. Professor Payne asked her to tutor at UWA but she was keen to do her Articles. The students had studies while doing articles as well as exams. The only way of passing a law degree was to complete the exams. 01:04:48 Antoinette did not work in the university holidays. Many of the male students worked on the wheat bins. People’s consumer wants and needs were much simpler. Antoinette drove a car to university. The car parks were always full. Petrol was not as expensive. Antoinette had a Commonwealth scholarship but her family was also able to support her. Her parents attended the graduation ceremony in Winthrop Hall in 1967. Charles Court was the speaker. Antoinette was doing her articles at SE Tippett and Ellis. The Dean, Professor Edwards, organised this for her with Ted Ellis. Antoinette won the Herbert H Wheatley Memorial Prize in commercial law and the HCG Keall Memorial Prize for the top student in 4th year. 01:13:03 Interview 2 Track 1 00:00 Introduction by Julia Wallis 00:43 Track 2 00:00 Dorothy Hewitt and Edward Ellis of S E Tippett & Ellis were Communists. Many became Socialists after Nikita Khrushchev denounced Josef Stalin in 1956. Antoinette wasn’t involved in student politics. Some students with Liberal Party leanings wanted to break down student unionism. Vietnam protests took place after Antoinette left UWA. Some fellow students were called up. Antoinette acted for conscientious objectors but Peter Dowding did most of this work. Antoinette was not invited to do Honours. A fellow graduate, Judith Gardam, was furious that the women were excluded. Honours wasn’t a prerequisite to practice law. 11:45 Antoinette did 2 years of articles with S E Tippett & Ellis. UWA Law School relied on the profession to teach and mentor the students. In 1968, she went to Godfrey Virtue. It was a bigger and more prestigious firm with a large general practice that included conveyancing; Shire law, common law and family law. There were no national or international firms in Perth at this stage. At most, firms had 12-18 partners. The senior partner, who was Antoinette’s mentor, left Godfrey Virtue and set up as a barrister. She realised that she had no prospects for advancement and quit Godfrey Virtue in 1971 to set up her own firm - AG Kennedy & Co. 17:44 There were no other female lawyers at Godfrey Virtue at that time. Ilbery Barblett, in the same building, had no female lawyers either. Paterson & Dowding had had a female lawyer but she left to work in the eastern states. The office building was behind St Andrews Church in Pier Street between the Terrace and Hay Street. Antoinette did a lot of Family Court work (including undefended divorces) and some Local Court work. At the Summary Relief Court, women lawyers were required to wear a hat. Some of the women wore joke hats but Antoinette wore attractive hats! For her first divorce appearance, Joe Tippett came down to support her. 22:54 Women were treated differently from men. Many of the magistrates did not take a woman seriously and/or trust what she said. Clients too might initially be worried about being represented by a woman. 26:45 Antoinette was not able to network with the men over drinks after work and thus pick up helpful tips about legal practice. She was not offered a junior brief in the 10 years that she was at the Bar. Government departments in WA have done much to address inequality as it was proved that WA was far behind the rest of Australia. Women were not supposed to drink in public bars in Perth in the 1960s and 70s. Popular bars were the Palace Hotel, the Esplanade Hotel, the Adelphi Hotel and the Weld Club. There were only 5-6 women in practice. Sheila McClemans who worked for the Law Society was very supportive. Antoinette was not aware of discrimination when she was a young graduate. It took a while for her to realise the disadvantages she faced. The Second Wave of American feminists and Germaine Greer’s book The Female Eunuch became popular in the 1970s. In about 1982, 20 women attended a meeting to set up the Women Lawyers Association. 34:40 Antoinette founded her own business despite these factors. She rented a space from two barristers. The bank would not give her an overdraft so she had to use her savings. Female clients flooded in. She worked all hours and weekends for 4 years doing mainly Family Court work, criminal law and motor vehicle accidents. She did not have trouble getting paid as she often under-charged! After she sold the business, she travelled around the world for 9 months. On her return, she had enough money to go to the Bar. 42:42 Divorce became commonplace. Women did not feel the need to remain married to an abusive husband. In 1972, Gough Whitlam was elected as Prime Minister. He appointed Elizabeth Reid as the world's first advisor on women's affairs. In 1974, he brought in the supporting parents benefit. Antoinette worked on adoption cases at Tippett & Ellis. The Family Law Act 1975 established the principle of no-fault divorce. Lionel Murphy was Attorney-General. Elizabeth Evatt was made the first Chief Judge of the Family Court of Australia. At last, women got a fair deal regarding property. 53:18 As a barrister, Antoinette depended on the legal profession for work. The Independent Bar was set up in 1970 by Sir Francis Burt. It was resented in some quarters. The Bar was located at 524 Hay Street. Antoinette paid rent for her room and a library fee and shared secretarial support. Later, the Bar moved to Law Chambers. Working at the Bar was quite convivial. There were lots of laughs and drinks at the office on Friday nights. She is disappointed that she never was offered a junior brief in the 10 years she was there. She was the only woman at the Bar at that time. Val French was the first female barrister but only overlapped with Antoinette for about a year. Vivian Payne used to send Antoinette work. Antoinette found the first 6-7 months quite difficult. She did family law, motor vehicle cases, commercial cases and some criminal jury trials. 0:01:01 Antoinette wasn’t asked to tutor or lecture UWA law students. Douglas Payne did a good job of professionalising the UWA Law School. The law changed very slowly in those ten years. A big change was the treatment of the victims of sexual assault. This came about due to pressure from women in the community rather than from inside the legal profession. WA was at the forefront in taking children out of the court and allowing them to give evidence by video link from a separate location. They also had separate entrances so that they didn’t have to face the accused. 01:06:12 Interview 3 Track 1 00:00 00:46 Track 2 00:00 Members of the Bar provided honorary legal advice and sat on boards as a form of community service. Sheila McClemans, for example, revived the Law Society. Antoinette was the Honorary Solicitor for the Netball Association for 4 years. Antoinette was a member of the WA Parole Board from 1983-1985. The Parole Board met monthly for a whole day. In 1984, she joined the Board of the Catholic Archbishop’s Social Justice Commission. The church had decided to put out a statement on criminal justice and sentencing. Antoinette chaired this team. Visiting speakers presented each month and Antoinette prepared summaries of these presentations. It was very helpful when she went onto the Bench. In 1984, Antoinette became President of the Women’s Lawyers Association. The first president was Vivian Payne. There were more female lawyers by this stage. 10:10 Antoinette became the first female judge of the District Court of Western Australia in 1985. The Western Mail ran an article on the lack of women in the legal profession and when Brian Burke was elected Premier of Western Australia in 1983, he pushed for more women judges. Two new appointments were created and His Honour Paul James Healy (deceased 2008) was appointed as well as Antoinette. The appointment of a female judge created animosity in some quarters. The Crown Law Department had expected the first female judge to be appointed from amongst their ranks. 16:07 Antoinette gave up her position at the Bar and was sworn in by the Governor. The Chief Judge showed her the ropes. There was no other training. Each judge has their own usher and Associate. Secretarial support was shared. District Court Associates are highly qualified clerical assistants who liaise with the legal profession. Antoinette did not employ law graduates – she preferred to have a highly qualified administrator. 22:56 The other judges were very helpful. Antoinette worked a full day at the District Court. She was not given long criminal trials or frauds when she was first appointed. Judges develop an expertise in a certain areas. Some are better at running a court and keeping a jury together. Some cannot make a decision. New South Wales have set up a judicial commission for tough cases. Some judges find it difficult to move from criminal work to civil. 28:33 Antoinette’s first civil case concerned a leading Prosthodontist who needed work in Sydney as the result of a motor vehicle accident. The Chief Judge, Des Heenan, wrote a long document on how to write judgments. He didn’t give this to Antoinette so she presumes that he thought her judgments were sound! Des Heenan was always willing to help when necessary. 32:15 Antoinette was used to jury trials when she was a barrister. Juries need to be managed and given plenty of breaks. The judge must explain the points of law. Some judges explain to the jury what is expected of them. 37:18 The court is a theatre. It is designed to keep the various parties separated. The District Court was the building where the Central Law Courts are now located. A new District Court building was built across the road. Antoinette was made Chief Judge in January 2004. The new building was already being discussed. It was opened on 3 June 2008. They needed to make the architects aware of what was needed and the importance of sight lines. They were advised by a former Chief Judge to push for more jury courts rather than ask for river views. Jim McGinty the Attorney- General was very supportive. The Supreme Court also used the new building and didn’t want it called “District Court” but Antoinette stood firm. 47:08 Their wish list included decent sized offices for the judges and how the courts were to be set up. Being able to see everyone is important. There was a Technology Committee and that was incorporated in the specifications. The building was designed with separate entrances. Separate cores are necessary for the general public, the jury and the judges. This makes a court building difficult to construct. Security is another aspect. The District Court has more trials than the Supreme Court (both civil and criminal). Antoinette likens the District Court to K-Mart and the Supreme Court to an exclusive boutique. They are quite different. 56:30 The workload in the District Court has increased over the years. Cases have changed and become more serious. Drugs and sexual abuse cases have increased. Paul Healy annotated the Criminal Code and distributed his material and often referenced all the cases. A judge becomes hardened to the things they hear. They do not have time to dwell on cases because there is always another case to hear. Antoinette found hearing sex trials with young children to be very distressing. 01:03:46 The media can be very critical of judges. Antoinette’s decisions were the subject of many a talk-back radio programme. At one stage the prosecution mounted an attack on her. They combed through her list of cases (there were 20-28 cases a day) to find cases where somebody was let off and appeal the decision to the Supreme Court. This started in earnest at the end of 1988 when Red Burt (Sir Francis Burt) was no longer Chief Justice. He was replaced by David Malcolm. It continued until about 1992. Antoinette was portrayed in the media as emotional, incompetent and unprofessional. 01:08:00 A German criminologist, Dr Christian Pfeiffer, came to Perth and talked to her about sentencing. After the event, Dr Pfeiffer rang Antoinette and warned her that she was being undermined by her own colleagues. This was devastating. She was able to make it generally known that she would make it public if things didn’t improve. She was not defended by the women lawyers or her fellow UWA graduates. 01:14:14 This smear campaign was damaging to Antoinette and all women in the legal profession. It was an unfortunate and upsetting period but she has survived and outlived all her detractors. The UWA law student graduates of 1967 have fairly regular reunions. 01:18:56 Audio Files Links to audio files <a href="http://oralhistories.arts.uwa.edu.au/files/original/940461badb5d447bbef49d515093d39b.mp3">Kennedy, Interview 1, Track 1</a> <br /><a href="http://oralhistories.arts.uwa.edu.au/files/original/4480f13fd1567b345a0a92ff58dab303.mp3">Kennedy, Interview 1, Track 2</a> <br /><a href="http://oralhistories.arts.uwa.edu.au/files/original/b486e9d0501190f5edcfbc6d3a28785d.mp3">Kennedy, Interview 2, Track 1</a> <br /><a href="http://oralhistories.arts.uwa.edu.au/files/original/0f30dc56841c0041c1c03b944b5c6b6d.mp3">Kennedy, Interview 2, Track 2</a> <br /><a href="http://oralhistories.arts.uwa.edu.au/files/original/573282929371da73b8d027a0f5c34e85.mp3">Kennedy, Interview 3, Track 1</a> <br /><a href="http://oralhistories.arts.uwa.edu.au/files/original/af50a4a70f0c414d8f9ac3d876195332.mp3">Kennedy, Interview 3, Track 2</a> <br /><a href="http://oralhistories.arts.uwa.edu.au/files/original/4af1225b9dda5de33c8cf95c01d84f30.mp3">Kennedy, Interview 3, Track 3</a> Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Antoinette Kennedy interview, 18 November 2014, 9 December 2014 and 17 December 2014 Subject The topic of the resource Law Description An account of the resource The Honourable Antoinette Kennedy AO graduated from UWA with a Bachelor of Laws in 1967. She was the first and longest serving woman judge in Western Australia, serving for 25 years. She was appointed as Chief Judge of the District Court for 6 years; the first woman head of a jurisdiction in Western Australia and only the third in Australia. She was made Officer in the Order of Australia (AO) and was elected to the WA Women’s Hall of Fame in 201. She was a member of Murdoch Senate for six years, founding member of the Women Lawyers of Western Australia, member of the Chief Justice’s Gender Bias Taskforce and a mentor in the Law Society mentoring program for young lawyers. Antoinette is outspoken on issues of social justice and has a keen interest in the provision of affordable housing. She retired from the law in 2010. Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Kennedy, Antoinette Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available University of Western Australia Historical Society Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource Copyright holder University of Western Australia Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource MP3 files Type The nature or genre of the resource Oral History Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource UWA ORAL HISTORIES Description An account of the resource A collection of interviews with former UWA staff, recorded by the <a href="http://www.alumni.uwa.edu.au/community/historical-society" target="_blank">UWA Historical Society</a> to mark the Centenary of the University in 2013. <br />The UWA Historical Society’s <a href="http://www.alumni.uwa.edu.au/community/historical-society/oral-histories" target="_blank">Oral History Program</a> started as a project with four oral histories funded from Society resources. It was then expanded with support from every Faculty on campus, the Guild, Convocation and through private donations. Additional funding was received through a Heritage Grant. Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available University of Western Australia Historical Society Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource University of Western Australia Historical Society Oral History A resource containing historical information obtained in interviews with persons having firsthand knowledge. Interviewer The person(s) performing the interview John Bannister Interviewee The person(s) being interviewed Louis Landau Duration Length of time involved (seconds, minutes, hours, days, class periods, etc.) Interview 1: 41 minutes, 42 seconds Interview 2: 47 minutes, 12 seconds Total: 1 hour, 28 minutes, 54 seconds Bit Rate/Frequency Rate at which bits are transferred (i.e. 96 kbit/s would be FM quality audio) 128 kbs Time Summary A summary of an interview given for different time stamps throughout the interview Interview 1 00:00:00 Louis Isaac Landau Background Melbourne 1942. Origins of study in Melbourne. Psychiatry. Paediatrics. Children’s Hospital Melbourne. Howard Williams asthma. Interest in paediatric respiratory medicine. Montreal. Research Melbourne and Montreal. Looking at respiratory illness in large cohort of children. 00:06:00 William McNickle study. Studying in detail in utero. Ultra sound. Recruiting mothers and studying babies to the age of 22. Sabbatical in Jerusalem and the pressurising box. Lung function in babies. 00:10:10 Importance in sabbatical for advancement. Bill Macdonald dies. Coming to Perth and applying for the chair. Mary Margaret Patricia Ryan persuades to Perth. 00:13:30 Head of paediatric and thoracic medicine in Melbourne. Bill Macdonald reputation. Princess Margaret Hospital. Jack Mann and Houghton’s winery. 00:17:15 Reputation of UWA and early career. New medical school. Professor of paediatrics and impressions of UWA in 1984. Bill Macdonald and his influence on UWA. Poor part of Princess Margaret Hospital. Assisting young children. 00:22:30 UWA and rural and wider community. Sustaining a large paediatric service. Accepting trainees in WA. Larger populations in rural community. Running the small department of 5 or 6 people. Growth and growing. Bill Macdonald and research. research and practice. Telethon child institute and funding. 00:27:00 Gustav Nossal. Looking for a director. Fiona Stanley. Support and generous to needs. Jonathan Carapetis. Development of the institute. Memories of Fiona Stanley. ‘One day she is going to do great things’. Working with her. 00:30:20 Support of the department from the university. Isolation. Princess Margaret Hospital and QEII site. Contributions of and commitment, principal players. Des Gurry, Ian Lewis, Kevin Turner, Peter Le Souef. 00:34:55 Bill Karmen. The sabbatical system. London and institute for child health and cohort studies. Bristol study. The Raine Study. Learning from sabbatical experience. Two racial groups and genetic make up. Inaccurate data. 00:40:30 Reputation and Importance of UWA. Barry Marshall. International recognition. Interview 2 00:00:00 Memories of Des Gurry, Ian Walpole, Bill Macdonald. Athol Hockey, Pru Manners. Doctor Ian Mormon main role in hospital. Peter Le Souef and David Forbes. 00:03:30 1996 dean of the faculty of medicine. Aims and expansion. Curriculum. Moving into the future. Graduate entry course. Vary from law to science. Small range of undergraduate courses. New style of teaching. Funding simulation centre. Edith Cowan and WAAPA. 00:07:50 Government funding and commitment to rural training. Port Hedland – Kalgoorlie. Successful achievements. Rural clinical school. Satisfying development and the teaching of dentists. Increasing numbers of students. new development. 00:12:10 Training of dentistry in rural sights. isolated communities requiring dental. Child and adult health research centre. Funding and WAIMR. Increasing aging population. Sir Charles Gairdner Hospital, Fiona Stanley Hospital. Education and curriculum unit and developments. Teaching on the run Fiona Lake. Lectures on the program. 00:17:00 Inter campus and competition with other universities. UWA’s position. Notre Dame. Murdoch and Edith Cowan. Competing and cohesion. 00:21:30 Personal research. Lung function in babies and elder children. Anti smoking lobby. Writing papers. Research into childhood asthma and in utero. East and West German comparisons with asthma. 00:26:54 New drugs Theophylline and Ephedrine. Adrenalin. Difficulty with treatment of asthma. Ventolin and steroids. Problems with Cystic fibrosis. Methods of treatment. Pollution in child health. Allergies. 00:32:30 WA and Allergies clean environment and growth in asthma. Order of Australia medal for work in Paediatrics. Credit for others. NHMRC, AMC and other organisations. Proud of contributions. Study and training in medicine. Drugs registered. 00:39:45 ADHD is a political football. Autism spectrum disorder. The autism association. Current situation with chid health. Social and emotional issues. Pressures that children are exposed to. Suicide. Collaboration and infrastructure. 00:44:50 Direction of UWA today. Medicine and paediatrics recognised internationally recognised. Robert Smith, Fay Gale, Deryck Schreuder and Alan Robson. Robson was very supportive. Hopes for Paul Johnson. Audio Files Links to audio files <a href="http://oralhistories.arts.uwa.edu.au/files/original/79db5d51015bae79a71c755e98b18812.mp3">Landau, Interview 1, Track 1</a> <br /><a href="http://oralhistories.arts.uwa.edu.au/files/original/95139f6e834b69b2b2f78948567e13a3.mp3">Landau, Interview 1, Track 2</a> Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Louis Landau interview, 20 September 2012 Subject The topic of the resource Medicine Description An account of the resource In 1984 Louis Landau became Professor of Paediatrics at UWA and from 1996 he was Dean of the Faculty of Medicine and Dentistry at the University. During the interview he speaks of the growth at the university in the department of medicine that he helped to develop during his 20 year involvement at the university. He looks at the important people associated with the development of the department and includes his impressions of Bill Madonald and Fiona Stanley among others. Louis was also helped to establish two of Perth’s most significant medical research institutes – the Telethon Institute of Child Health Research (TICHR) and WA Institute of Medical Research (WAIMR). A specialist in the field of paediatrics, he is the founding chair of the Institute for Child Health Research. Louis talks of his work and research in the department of paediatrics at the Princess Margaret Hospital. Landau is a champion of research and teaching and has been awarded the Order of Australia Medal for his work in paediatrics and respiratory medicine. Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Landau, Louis Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available University of Western Australia Historical Society Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource Copyright holder University of Western Australia Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource MP3 files Type The nature or genre of the resource Oral History